Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?
09-19-2011 | 04:13 AM
Happy to be here
Joined: Jun 2006
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From: A-320A
Really?
Merged Delta was the only legacy airline not to furlough during the last downturn. In fact, Delta hired 305 since the merger. Two early out programs took a fair number of guys off the top, but even with the retirement of two uneconomic fleets there were no furloughs.
That reality conflicts with the perception posted above. Merger setting them back?
Ask the bottom 1450 at UAL, the bottom 10% of Alaska, the bottom 1700 at AMR, the 147 at CAL. Heck, even a bunch of the regionals furloughed. That's being set back.
Merged Delta was the only legacy airline not to furlough during the last downturn. In fact, Delta hired 305 since the merger. Two early out programs took a fair number of guys off the top, but even with the retirement of two uneconomic fleets there were no furloughs.
That reality conflicts with the perception posted above. Merger setting them back?
Ask the bottom 1450 at UAL, the bottom 10% of Alaska, the bottom 1700 at AMR, the 147 at CAL. Heck, even a bunch of the regionals furloughed. That's being set back.
09-19-2011 | 04:13 AM
veut gagner à la loterie
Joined: Apr 2008
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From: Light Chop
And Newton would have 32 int's if the average held. Which is 1/4 of what Big Ben is out to do on turnovers and they'll probably still make the playoffs.
09-19-2011 | 04:15 AM
veut gagner à la loterie
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From: Light Chop
09-19-2011 | 04:15 AM
Gets Weekends Off
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Slow,
All true, but little consolation for a lot of our junior guys. We are stagnating. Guys off the top don't really help guys on the bottom too much if we don't hire and grow.
For example, and I do realize that this is exaggerated, but it makes the point. If the top 25% leave the 2nd quartile is now mostly the top (huge benefit). The third quartile moves up to mostly the 2nd (large benefit) but the bottom 25% are pretty much still the bottom, albeit now reaching up to 33% on the list (marginal to zero benefit).
Granted UAL and AMR are worse but every Pilot hired after about 1999 would be making more if they instead went to Southwest, FDX, Jet Blue, Virgin (mostly), Atlas, and who knows who else.
I am hoping our next contract will change that and who knows what the future holds, but as of now every Pilot hired after around 1999 at the worlds biggest airline would have been better off going to a lot of other airlines. I would think this would be a concern for all DAL Pilots - realizing that guys would have been better off going to LCC's.
This is why the junior guys fixate on Scope.
Scoop
All true, but little consolation for a lot of our junior guys. We are stagnating. Guys off the top don't really help guys on the bottom too much if we don't hire and grow.
For example, and I do realize that this is exaggerated, but it makes the point. If the top 25% leave the 2nd quartile is now mostly the top (huge benefit). The third quartile moves up to mostly the 2nd (large benefit) but the bottom 25% are pretty much still the bottom, albeit now reaching up to 33% on the list (marginal to zero benefit).
Granted UAL and AMR are worse but every Pilot hired after about 1999 would be making more if they instead went to Southwest, FDX, Jet Blue, Virgin (mostly), Atlas, and who knows who else.
I am hoping our next contract will change that and who knows what the future holds, but as of now every Pilot hired after around 1999 at the worlds biggest airline would have been better off going to a lot of other airlines. I would think this would be a concern for all DAL Pilots - realizing that guys would have been better off going to LCC's.
This is why the junior guys fixate on Scope.
Scoop
09-19-2011 | 04:51 AM
The Brown Dot +1
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 7,775
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From: 777B
Slow,
All true, but little consolation for a lot of our junior guys. We are stagnating. Guys off the top don't really help guys on the bottom too much if we don't hire and grow.
For example, and I do realize that this is exaggerated, but it makes the point. If the top 25% leave the 2nd quartile is now mostly the top (huge benefit). The third quartile moves up to mostly the 2nd (large benefit) but the bottom 25% are pretty much still the bottom, albeit now reaching up to 33% on the list (marginal to zero benefit).
Granted UAL and AMR are worse but every Pilot hired after about 1999 would be making more if they instead went to Southwest, FDX, Jet Blue, Virgin (mostly), Atlas, and who knows who else.
I am hoping our next contract will change that and who knows what the future holds, but as of now every Pilot hired after around 1999 at the worlds biggest airline would have been better off going to a lot of other airlines. I would think this would be a concern for all DAL Pilots - realizing that guys would have been better off going to LCC's.
This is why the junior guys fixate on Scope.
Scoop
All true, but little consolation for a lot of our junior guys. We are stagnating. Guys off the top don't really help guys on the bottom too much if we don't hire and grow.
For example, and I do realize that this is exaggerated, but it makes the point. If the top 25% leave the 2nd quartile is now mostly the top (huge benefit). The third quartile moves up to mostly the 2nd (large benefit) but the bottom 25% are pretty much still the bottom, albeit now reaching up to 33% on the list (marginal to zero benefit).
Granted UAL and AMR are worse but every Pilot hired after about 1999 would be making more if they instead went to Southwest, FDX, Jet Blue, Virgin (mostly), Atlas, and who knows who else.
I am hoping our next contract will change that and who knows what the future holds, but as of now every Pilot hired after around 1999 at the worlds biggest airline would have been better off going to a lot of other airlines. I would think this would be a concern for all DAL Pilots - realizing that guys would have been better off going to LCC's.
This is why the junior guys fixate on Scope.
Scoop
I flew with a 777A on reserve a couple trips ago. SWA FO's make as much or more than him. Gear slingers on a 135 seat jet make more that a polar route flying, risk mitigating, 270 seat international captain at the worlds (2nd) largest airline.
I guess the same holds true for the 400 seat jet 747 reserve captains.
09-19-2011 | 05:35 AM
Line Holder
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,257
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Hey Carl, in the latest Trade-a-Plane there is a 747-400 listed for only $26m. Time to get your airline up and running!
1992 BOEING 747-400 Jet Aircraft For Sale At Controller.com
1992 BOEING 747-400 Jet Aircraft For Sale At Controller.com
09-19-2011 | 05:43 AM
Can't abide NAI
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 12,078
Likes: 15
From: Douglas Aerospace post production Flight Test & Work Around Engineering bulletin dissembler
Hey Carl, in the latest Trade-a-Plane there is a 747-400 listed for only $26m. Time to get your airline up and running!
1992 BOEING 747-400 Jet Aircraft For Sale At Controller.com
1992 BOEING 747-400 Jet Aircraft For Sale At Controller.com
09-19-2011 | 06:02 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 3,045
Likes: 1
From: FO
Hey come on now, after yesterday if the Packers keep it up they'll also give up 6,000+ yards on passing defense at the end of the regular season.
And Newton would have 32 int's if the average held. Which is 1/4 of what Big Ben is out to do on turnovers and they'll probably still make the playoffs.
And Newton would have 32 int's if the average held. Which is 1/4 of what Big Ben is out to do on turnovers and they'll probably still make the playoffs.
09-19-2011 | 06:25 AM
Gets Weekends Off
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Posts: 784
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From: Still in one
The grass is always greener.
09-19-2011 | 07:01 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Apr 2008
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From: LAX ERA
Ok boys, I'm back from the 1st Fighter Association reunion. I realize this isn't Facekbook, but since it's aviation related (vs football ) I'll pass on a few goodies.
We were inducted onto the "Aviation Wall of Fame" at the old Mission Inn in Riverside, CA. Guess it was for our service after WWII at March AFB. I didn't realize what a big deal it was until all the local and Calif big wigs showed up for the ceremony.
But the best part was, we even had 8 of the old WWII guys still there. One guy was 92, as sharp as he was in his 20s and a newly wed (ok, 18 months ago but everything is relative). She was a knockout in her 70s, so going 20 years younger is always a player
(Buzz). Anyway, great time! If I run into anyone in the LAX pilot lounge I'll bore ya with my pictures..........Including my flight in a PT-22 that we had for our flying day. The old guys hadn't flown it since pilot training. They all made a flight and no one broke a hip
Ferd
) I'll pass on a few goodies.We were inducted onto the "Aviation Wall of Fame" at the old Mission Inn in Riverside, CA. Guess it was for our service after WWII at March AFB. I didn't realize what a big deal it was until all the local and Calif big wigs showed up for the ceremony.
But the best part was, we even had 8 of the old WWII guys still there. One guy was 92, as sharp as he was in his 20s and a newly wed (ok, 18 months ago but everything is relative). She was a knockout in her 70s, so going 20 years younger is always a player
(Buzz). Anyway, great time! If I run into anyone in the LAX pilot lounge I'll bore ya with my pictures..........Including my flight in a PT-22 that we had for our flying day. The old guys hadn't flown it since pilot training. They all made a flight and no one broke a hipFerd
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