I think that the ulcer that is burning a hole through his esophagus eminates from the knowledge and fact that in the future, ex-TWA pilots will be receiving large checks for career damages from ALPA.

Thus the insults.

Not making yourself very distinguished here slow. We can all see right through you.

 

I don't think he stabbed anyone in the back. That was a face shot.

The word "unity" sounds good, but there's no more direct attack on professional unity than doing the same work as your peers for less money.

Nothing but respect for the hard work going on at regional airlines, but it blows me away when junior guys rail on the old salts for "selling," or losing, or relaxing scope. Show me where in any major airline contract it lays out the crappy work rules and low pay at the regionals. Guys fly there because it provided the quickest access to turbine time to build your flight time. Because of circumstance, unwillingness, or inability to gain experience by other means- guys in that world are willingly engaging in a known transaction: crappy pay for experience and flight time.

Man up and admit it- that willingness to work for less is destroying the very thing they aspire to.

Everyone wants to talk about what a pilot is worth, how much we used to make, etc.

A pilot is "worth" whatever he or she is willing to work for, period.

 

While you have some good points, the simple fact is that it remains our burden at mainline to reel scope back in. As long as the low paying jobs are there, people will take them to build their time in hopes of getting that dream job.

 

Well, considering not a single major has passed a scope clause stating minimum pay or conditions for outsourced flying, or even that it must be outsourced to another ALPA carrier... it's pretty much the natural, and desired, end result in a system where feed flying can be shuffled around at will. Regional guys *have* tried to hold up their end of the deal at various carriers in the past - Comair, Horizon, Expressjet, ACA, Air Wisconsin, Eagle to name a few with good past contracts - and in every single instance the result was stagnation, shrinkage, loss of feed agreements, furloughs, and 8 year FOs with no hope in hell of going to Delta. The system is set up to reward those regional airlines, and their pilots, that undercut the others. It was set up that way with full knowledge and acquiescence from ALPA. It doesn't excuse those of us who took low-paying jobs from all responsibility...but you can't say the problem began and ended with us, either.

Slowplay, as an alpa apologist and defender of the status quo including the outsourcing system in place today, should be the VERY last person to dish out a low blow at someone who is a product of that system.

 

And as professionals, I think we shouldn't hesitate to point out the effect those pilots have on wages and the profession as a whole.

 

Whidbey;

I agree with almost eveything you said. The buck does begin and end with us. If you are new to mother D as your avatar says, you will find that about 65% of your coworkers vote yes every time. If you should on occasion find yourself in the 35% crowd, welcome to reality. This isn't baseball arbitration. There are no merit upgrades. There are no O-2 or O-3 NATOPs or OEV (DOV) guys.

-88 drvr came to DAL from TWA, a major airline that worked for less due to a robber baron who gutted that company. If you were in his shoes and noone was hiring, would you have chosen unemployment due to your principles or would you have continued to feed your family while you tried to move up to a better (paying) company.

I am not new to mother D. I miss that starry eyed great feeling when I got hired. I didn't know squat about unions. I grew up in the merit upgrade culture of the military.

While I cannot put it into words why, I don't begrudge the vast majority of regional pilots on anything (there are some bottom feeders that I cant vouch for). I dont know why, despite really REALLY wanting to reel in scope. I dont want to just pull up the ladder. I say bring 'em aboard, they've been doing the job of flying DAL pax for years.

In the end, pilots are only worth what the MAJORITY are willing to work for.

 

Why don't we take the 90M we got from the slot sale and put it as a down payment to buy Hawaiian Air?

 

Yeah 80 I agree. I think some people have been sitting in their current seat too long and are blind to the fact that all scope was GIVEN to the regionals. Those regional pilots didn't sneak in and steal anything.
For all of you that say they should man up and not take a low paying job. How about this....The legacies man up and stop voting it out. None of us have a gun to our head to vote for scope loss any more than they have a gun to their head to put food on the table.

Only we can control our scope. So is everyone ready to be a man (or woman ) ? End of story

 

Just a question for the 7ER guys.

What is a commonly used headset on the fleet? The Telex 750?

NWA used to provide those, but I don't imagine that has been maintained since the merger. I'm wondering if I need to buy my own pair?

Also, would the 7ER guys on reserve recommend signing up for Global Entry?

Thanks in advance.

 

Lots of lawsuits like this and there will be lots more. Someone always wants to blame someone or something when things turn south. In the end they are almost always settled for a few pennies and cash to the lawyers. The chances of ALPA or their insurance agent paying large checks to TWA pilots is not very high. Keep in mind one important principle of the law. To get damages you have to show where and how you were damaged and convert that to a financial loss. Had TWA pilots not accepted the APA offer would they be better or worse off today. Anyone who knew TWA's status at the merger can probably answer that.