Originally Posted by tomgoodman

Technically, that's true -- but they may think it will be necessary in order to keep other unions off the property. It's always useful to know what your opponent is thinking during negotiations, even if (and perhaps especially if) their thinking is erroneous.

Originally Posted by TheManager

Interesting. Recently listened to a base ALPA rep explain that we should not be focused on this above. Instead of using the metric outlined in the agreement, EASK for passenger and freight, he claimed that we should focus on the block hours.

His next claim was that we are way ahead in block hours as compared to the Atlantic JV partners to the tune of 68% done by Delta. Unbelievable the spin, but 100% true.

Originally Posted by freightguy

i smell management rats on this forum trying to 'manage' our expectations!

Originally Posted by freightguy

I have nothing against going to fly a contract gig. I am just amazed why anyone would want to go live in the planet's anus, but like you said, to each his own.

Tsquare, there is a world beyond Florida. For example, I don't think the beaches in Thailand looks anything like the planet's anus when compared to parts of Florida, Detroit, New York etc. (Many of my Far East expat friends live in Thailand and commute. There are even some current Delta pilots living there). Now... there are a lot of beautiful l-asses running around, which is a whole another topic. It's cheap to live, it's sunny year round, there are plenty of women and the beer is cheap. It will work for me if Delta plays nasty. Like you said, to each it's own. But I agree with you on the middle east. I can't do it... it's too different.

Don't inflate the importance of your leaving.. just sayin'... There are thousands of guys that would kill to have your seniority number.

Just stop talking like the company owes YOU something or you will leave. I promise you that they couldn't care less.

My leaving Delta will not make any ripples... granted. However, I won't be the only one leaving. When the retirements pick up, it will be an issue. Talk to any random regional guys/gals out there and most of the time the pick is Fedex, UPS, Southwest, Emirates etc. Delta is where they plan to go, if plan A,B,C and D does not work out. There will be a lot of pilots who will take the Delta job. But they will get their ratings and move onto greener pastures when those doors open. The old days of Delta occupying the top of the hiring food chain is slipping away. If nothing is done, Delta will have a problem attracting qualified talent.

I'm sorry if I offend you, but I do think that the company owes the pilot group a restoration of our contract... to the minimum. We gave out a temporary pay-cut. But that loan is long past the due date.

Unlike the management, we don't have the power to pat each other on the back and write million dollar bonus checks. But we are pilots. We are an extremely important piece of the finanancial back-bone of an airline. If we all operate the airplane exactly 'by the book' in the most conservative fashion, that can easily wipe out their entire profit book. I am a very important piece and so are you. Lets act like it and we can turn this industry around. The old days of scabbing are gone. We got two pilots from the entire US who crossed the picket line during the Spirit Airlines pilot strike... a far cry from the old Lorenzo-Continental days. I'm damn proud of today's airline pilot group in the United States. With massive retirements in the horizon and record low number of graduating pilots, the supply-demand curve is turning to our favor as well. Let's sieze the opportunity, rather than making lame excuses for the management.

That's all I have to say about that!

Originally Posted by freightguy

I smell management rats on this forum trying to 'manage' our expectations!

Originally Posted by TheManager

Interesting. Recently listened to a base ALPA rep explain that we should not be focused on this above. Instead of using the metric outlined in the agreement, EASK for passenger and freight, he claimed that we should focus on the block hours.

His next claim was that we are way ahead in block hours as compared to the Atlantic JV partners to the tune of 68% done by Delta. Unbelievable the spin, but 100% true.

Originally Posted by georgetg

A lot of obfuscation going on. When we grow, we do grow at an advantage vis a vis the European partners because we produce fewer EASKs per jet than they do, so we gotta add more flights.

The reverse is also true. We have to cut many more flights to get the same EASK reduction than they have to, so more block hours cut year over year.

Unfortunately we have reduced our EASKs at a greater rate than them and required to cancel/reduce many more flights than them, thus many more block hours cut on our side vs theirs.

Ask how many flights they cut, and how many we cut and how many block hours/month the cuts represent...

Cheers
George

Originally Posted by Scoop

Sailing,

"Whats with the negative waves?"


Kelly's Heroes Oddball - Negative Waves - YouTube


DAL 2011 revenue: 35.12B/12056 Pilots = $2,913,072 per Pilot.

LUV 2011 revenue: 15.5B/6104 Pilots = $2,565,530 per Pilot.

Revenue numbers from Yahoo Finance.
Pilot numbers from APC Airline profiles.


Delta Pilots produce more revenue per Pilot than Southwest Pilots. You can argue numbers many different ways - I think this is might be a good starting point.

Scoop

Originally Posted by tsquare

I admire your passion. I really do. I hope that it is contagious and that the rest of the pilot group gets it too.

Some of what you said I agree with.. probably more than you realize. Some I do not.

As far as how many leave, it's like Cramer says "Therer's always a bull market somewhere" You're leaving will creat a bull market here at DAL for someone else. There are thousands of qualified pilots out there that DO have DAL as their first choice.. actually I am not going to get into that argument with you. I'll let Cramer's quote speak for itself. booyah