Airline Pilot Central Forums - Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?

I'm not one of them. This is what happens when we shrink. Guys are squeezed and are willing to go to school at a shot at a left seat even if only for a year.

I think guys are doing what Timbo suggested...trying to grab a relatively senior captain position with a guaranteed MD/paid move a year later to whatever they can hold. I'm not bidding it. I'm not even close to being able to hold Captain on it, and don't care to ever spend another summer in that right seat.

Carl Spackler

03-15-2012 05:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bucking Bar (Post 1151559)

The concept of ratios and balances with DCI was tried, and failed, in Contract 2000. So was this "holding company" language. When Delta management needed every ounce of performance from the DCI network to try to save the Company the passengers (and the pilots) allowed those provisions of Contract 2000 to be jettisoned almost immediately to save the ship. When our job protection provisions fail, we should not simply wait until the next Section 6 and renegotiate them back in again.

Our Section 1 proposal, along with numerous anecdotal accounts, tells me ALPA (specifically the Delta MEC) intends to remain in this outsourcing partnership with management.

You're clearly correct. The only question now is, what strategy do us line pukes employ now that we KNOW our bargaining agent has this intention.

Carl

Carl Spackler

03-15-2012 05:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tsquare (Post 1151613)

The productivity argument. If ya'll wanna continue with that one, then you better forget about getting FedEx or UPS rates, because they are FAR more productive than we are...

Totally incorrect. We fly a lot more hard hours per month than FDX or UPS.

I know you couldn't care less about strengthening scope unless it is given to us as a no cost item. But if you're going to continue to make management's case for them, you need to at least know that we're far more productive than our brothers at FDX and UPS.

Carl

tsquare

03-15-2012 05:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Carl Spackler (Post 1152171)

First off, you are a damn liar when it comes to my feelings regarding strengthening of scope... DAMN LIAR.

Second. So then you must agree that the size of the airplane makes no difference when it comes to pay. Good.. I have you in my camp now. The M88 and the 747 should pay the same because you JUST said that we fly more hard hours than FedEx and THAT makes us more productive. Or is it the size of the airplane and the fact that it holds more people? Which is it Carl?

tsquare

03-15-2012 05:47 AM

I really shouldn't let you get under my skin Carl. You have brown eyes? Thought so.

/ignore

Carl Spackler

03-15-2012 05:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FIIGMO (Post 1151616)

Carl,

I am disappointed too with what I am reading, but I fail to see as you say, any proof that this a watered down version or that ALPA was worried that telling us the truth was not appropriate. Do you know for a fact or just guessing. I am curious and I am angry as well, but does this mean we are being blatantly lied too?

I wasn't in the room, but my proof is as follows:

1. It looked just like previous openers...with the details redacted. Our union's opener template starts with the section name, then an opening declarative statement of fact as we see it, then a general goal of what we want to achieve in that section, then the detailed bullet points of what is our actual opening position. We've been shown all of this except the detailed bullets.

2. In many previous DALPA mailings, it was stated that our MEC spent the last year studying industry data, other contracts, Delta's finances with the EF&A team and pilot surveys to create a comprehensive opening position in time for the start of Section 6. They didn't spend all that time and energy to produce a concept.

3. They redacted all the details except the sprinkler system in hotels. Why would a "conceptual" opener include that extreme level of detail when scope and pay were so general? IMO, the evidence points to the fact that we exchanged openers with management the way we always have. Pilots just got the version with the details redacted...except sprinklers.

Carl

Amish Pilot

03-15-2012 06:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FmrFreightDog (Post 1151990)

Again, I have to ask... LCA? Because I think I know that guy.

Capt D-Bag was flying B757(7ER), not sure if he was a LCA, had a 38min connection to make so I didn't stick around.

Carl Spackler

03-15-2012 06:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FIIGMO (Post 1151616)

Also, my issue is with any mention of any DCI carrier or crew member getting any consideration at DAL at all whether scope, hiring, pass benefits anything.

I agree with you. It's more proof that the regional MEC's and ALPA national had a hand in writing our Section 1 opener. This should come as no surprise. The Ford-Cooksey lawsuit settlement requires it, and Moak's first letter to us after being elected president said: 'We will use all the tools at our disposal to ensure contracts are not self-interested, but rather reflect what is best for the entire industry as a whole'.

Quote:

Originally Posted by FIIGMO (Post 1151616)

JV and code share needs to be addressed in much stronger language. Alaska code share has decimated QOL of every pilot at DAL especially west coast crews. Absolute hard limit language on scope and no more scope concession period.

But that didn't happen FIIGMO. Now what?

Quote:

Originally Posted by FIIGMO (Post 1151616)

DPA is not even in the equation at all. They are not here now, maybe we will see but any comparison to what DPA would do is pure fantasy and frankly irritating.

I never mentioned or even hinted at DPA in any part of my post. Why be irritated about something I never said?

Carl

Carl Spackler

03-15-2012 06:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bucking Bar (Post 1151663)

This is just cathartic mental masturbation.

Quote:

Originally Posted by forgot to bid (Post 1151671)

Is that legal in Georgia?

Yes.

Because it's considered incest. :D

Carl

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