[QUOTE=Woger Wabbit;2409894]lol the Caps is for your eyes 👀 not your 👂's. In my humble opinion which probably means absolutely nothing, turning the wrong way on a RNAV departure is just as bad as the other scenarios. Just as dangerous. The fact that ATL revoked RNAV departures for EDV for a couple weeks is simply unacceptable.

 

[QUOTE=CBreezy;2409934]Air Canada nearly landed on a taxiway with multiple aircraft on it. Yes, that’s very disturbing. But what’s that have to do with RNAV departures out of ATL?


[QUOTE=Yumyum;2409936]Ahh, for my eyes. Thanks for your consideration. Was picturing you screaming those last couple words.

Getting revoked is certainly nothing to be proud of, but I find this all kind of interesting. When we started flying RNAVs out of DFW, this was a hot topic back then because crews were making very similar mistakes, and I don't recall them revoking our privileges.

Anyway, my productivity break is wrapping up. Play nice y'all.

 

Woger, you said if it had gone to a collision, it would have been disturbing. In making that point, you appear to say that it's only disturbing if it does get to that point. Just because you don't hit someone or trigger an RA, blatantly disregarding a clearance at one of the busiest airspaces in the world is troubling and disturbing. It doesn't have to just lead to a collision.

 

It's disturbing that a professional airline pilot thinks this issue is just "a little embarrassing maybe" and "not too bad". Embarrassing is the least of it. Complying with the departure procedures in ATL or anywhere else is a VERY big deal and failure to comply is pretty far from "not too bad". Botching this up disrupts what's already operating on the razor's edge down there.

How embarrassed will you be when the FAA suspends your license to give you time to think about it? Will that be not too bad as well?

Somebody here added something like "TCAS will keep you out of trouble if you mess up anyway". Come on people. Work on a better reputation for a change.

Pro tip: There's a page in your ATL jepps, 10-3-1 (AAUP pg. 2 of 2), that tells you the runway the departure will USUALLY use. Take advantage of it.

Verify the runway and legs as a crew; it should only take about 10 seconds but there's -always- sufficient time to get it done no matter what's going on. None of you should be advancing any throttles for takeoff until you do. Consider A/P use and actually observing sterile cockpit.

 

I don't get why people are making a big deal out of this. Clearance verification is what we are supposed to do. The pilot who didn't program the FMS is also supposed to verify the legs pages with the legs on the paper flight plan. If that is not being done then those crews only have themselves to blame.

You should never accept a clearance that you aren't ready to take. I have been sat #1 short of 13 in LGA and my DP has been changed along with a line up and wait clearance twice in one day. Both times that happened to me I had no problem telling the controller "unable lineup we need to verify the new departure and reprogram the FMS, it should take us less than 5 minutes." Never got pulled out of sequence. Never got *****ed at. It took a grand total of 90 seconds to enter the new DP and brief it each time.

If you are blocked out and getting paid then who cares if ATC pulls you out of sequence. My favorite phrase when ATC decided to change the departure/arrival runway, SID, or STAR at the last second is "unable, we need to get new numbers."

The fact that these crews DID NOT DO THEIR JOB is infuriating. Don't ever let ATC bully you into doing something you don't want to do. This topic really needs to come to a close.

 

Especially since RNAVs have been back in play for several days now and while I was there, all went well.

 

All I can say after reading some of this is......

Jesus take the wheel!

 

Thinking about applying to Endeavor. I would likely be commuting from PHL. It seems JFK and LGA are the junior bases, anyone here have any experience commuting to these bases out of PHL?

 

The commute is either by car or train... Better bet would be to apply to Piedmont and be based where you live.

 

We fly PHL-JFK...