Clearly it is working, Envoy is the hardest regional seat to get right now. More people wanting to get in vs. seats available.

I've looked at their history, I've been somewhat following the regional industry since the late 90's. I guess we just have to agree to disagree here.

 

Wow. Talk about a lack of one’s S.A.


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Every CA that upgrades is 67 an hour

 

Hmm ok, I thought 3 year CA pay is 70/hr? Assuming the CA upgrades at 3 years?

 

You are crazy if you think that $10 an hour is peanuts? That is a huge deal for people and surely makes a difference in our household.

Also, most dont upgrade with 70-73 an hour, its less.

This flow you are so gun ho about is great, assuming it works. The situation is a win/win for management. They get to pay us significantly less now because we value this flow so much, but if **** hits the fan and the economy goes defunct, guess what, they also win because are still the lowest paid. We take all the risk in this situation. Pay is a serious issue right now and one that needs to be addressed somehow. Sadly, since our company doesn't want to do the right thing for its pilot group, our only hope is that recruitment slows.

Welcome to the team, I know it can be hostile on here, but you will find that the people you work with are almost always very cool, and very helpful. However, given you are not even out of training yet, I find it a little early to be championing the cause of management and flow.

 

You would think, but you would be wrong. Hence why people are jumping on you about this. The flow from the outside and first few months looks great. However, once you have been here and see how the industry works from the inside, it begins to lose its shine.

Understand, that if the economy stays strong, I will flow within about 5 years of date of hire. If it stays strong. The problem is for the new people coming here and for those that dont get out prior to the economic slowdown that will eventually happen.

We need better pay rates now to protect us when things go upside down.

 

First, I won't be making 70 - 73 per hour when I'm forced to upgrade. Second, CA pay is not great on any step compared to the others.

In fact, CA pay is bad enough here that if your a senior FO that knows how to work the contract and schedule to your advantage, you're making a little more than that junior CA sitting to your left. All while getting weekends and holidays off!

There's a reason they have to force people to upgrade here.

 

You assume wrong.

Upgrade is street CA or immediately on 1000 hours 121. So that means year 1 if you come with hours or year two if you hustle and uograde around 18 months.

 

There is no doubt the flow is of great value, enough to bring people in despite the low pay. I would be ok with this concept, get paid less than everyone else but have a guaranteed flow, but here's why I'm not. At any moment the economy could tank, the majors could stop hiring or there could be some other unforeseen event, then what? The flow will stop. Those of us lucky enough not to get furloughed will be stuck at the regionals for a very long time and what type of contract and pay would you like to be under in such a scenario? Better contractual pay is protection for us. I'll be flowing in two years and hopefully nothing happens between now and then but for those of you looking at a 7 year flow, well a lot can happen between now and then. Not even the FO pay rates are contractual. At any moment the company could decide to return to $26 hr pay if it suits them. I'm not saying any of this will happen, I'm just saying what if it does.

 

This right here!!!

People so drunk on “flow kool-aid” they find an excuse for everything, even leaving thousands of dollars on the table. Hold yourself to a higher standard. Flow or no flow. We should be and need to be compensated better. Period.