Envoy 2020
04-07-2020, 11:13 AM
#421
In a land of unicorns
Joined APC: Apr 2014
Position: Whale FO
Posts: 6,470
Originally Posted by Cyio
So can we admit now that the 19 hour LOA agreement was a mistake? I mean come on, why in the hell did we even attempt to work with management? They have closed QT, canceled our training freezes, canceled upgrades for those awarded, "forgot" to mention to the schedulers about zero time lines and now have apparantly ceased all communication with our MEC.
Why do our MEC's always think the company is going to do the right thing? I just dont get it. They need to fight for every single inch and never assume that the company will honor anything, nor help us out in anyway shape or form that doesn't also benefit them. We should have thrown that stupid 19 hour LOA right across the table and walked out. Let them figure out how to save the company and come back with an industry neutral deal.
So frustrating. This is how it feels.
https://youtu.be/gk8NlRIZPIo
Why do our MEC's always think the company is going to do the right thing? I just dont get it. They need to fight for every single inch and never assume that the company will honor anything, nor help us out in anyway shape or form that doesn't also benefit them. We should have thrown that stupid 19 hour LOA right across the table and walked out. Let them figure out how to save the company and come back with an industry neutral deal.
So frustrating. This is how it feels.
https://youtu.be/gk8NlRIZPIo
What was the company supposed to "honor" after the LOA?
You make it sound like company made some promises to us if we ratify it. Just FYI: There were no promises given, or expected.
04-07-2020, 11:17 AM
#422
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2017
Posts: 3,659
Originally Posted by dera
What are you talking about?
What was the company supposed to "honor" after the LOA?
You make it sound like company made some promises to us if we ratify it. Just FYI: There were no promises given, or expected.
What was the company supposed to "honor" after the LOA?
You make it sound like company made some promises to us if we ratify it. Just FYI: There were no promises given, or expected.
We are all clearly aware there were no promises given on this LOA, but it did do exactly what I said it would do and that is stop them from negotiating for the rest of us. As predicted they are doing just that, with the added kick to the groin of shutting down our lock pay, qt and the rest I mentioned.
04-07-2020, 11:26 AM
#423
In a land of unicorns
Joined APC: Apr 2014
Position: Whale FO
Posts: 6,470
Originally Posted by Cyio
Of that entire post you chose one word to point out. Think that means I’m onto something. The second paragraph was an all encompassing one, not “just” about this LOA.
We are all clearly aware there were no promises given on this LOA, but it did do exactly what I said it would do and that is stop them from negotiating for the rest of us. As predicted they are doing just that, with the added kick to the groin of shutting down our lock pay, qt and the rest I mentioned.
We are all clearly aware there were no promises given on this LOA, but it did do exactly what I said it would do and that is stop them from negotiating for the rest of us. As predicted they are doing just that, with the added kick to the groin of shutting down our lock pay, qt and the rest I mentioned.
I think the status quo is not a bad place to be right now for the rest of us. Let's see what round 2 brings.
Even without the LOA, there would be no QT, no training freezes, and no CA pay for FOs. Just FYI.
04-07-2020, 11:30 AM
#424
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2017
Posts: 3,659
Originally Posted by dera
I think the status quo is not a bad place to be right now for the rest of us. Let's see what round 2 brings.
04-07-2020, 11:32 AM
#425
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2018
Posts: 183
Originally Posted by Cyio
So can we admit now that the 19 hour LOA agreement was a mistake? I mean come on, why in the hell did we even attempt to work with management? They have closed QT, canceled our training freezes, canceled upgrades for those awarded, "forgot" to mention to the schedulers about zero time lines and now have apparantly ceased all communication with our MEC.
Why do our MEC's always think the company is going to do the right thing? I just dont get it. They need to fight for every single inch and never assume that the company will honor anything, nor help us out in anyway shape or form that doesn't also benefit them. We should have thrown that stupid 19 hour LOA right across the table and walked out. Let them figure out how to save the company and come back with an industry neutral deal.
So frustrating. This is how it feels.
https://youtu.be/gk8NlRIZPIo
Why do our MEC's always think the company is going to do the right thing? I just dont get it. They need to fight for every single inch and never assume that the company will honor anything, nor help us out in anyway shape or form that doesn't also benefit them. We should have thrown that stupid 19 hour LOA right across the table and walked out. Let them figure out how to save the company and come back with an industry neutral deal.
So frustrating. This is how it feels.
https://youtu.be/gk8NlRIZPIo
04-07-2020, 11:33 AM
#426
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2017
Posts: 3,659
Originally Posted by dera
No you're not. You're just making stuff up in your head.
I think the status quo is not a bad place to be right now for the rest of us. Let's see what round 2 brings.
Even without the LOA, there would be no QT, no training freezes, and no CA pay for FOs. Just FYI.
I think the status quo is not a bad place to be right now for the rest of us. Let's see what round 2 brings.
Even without the LOA, there would be no QT, no training freezes, and no CA pay for FOs. Just FYI.
Status quo is great if you don’t mind exposing your family to higher risks of getting sick. Or if you can afford to live off less than minimum wage with the 19 hour deal.
I agree there wouldn’t be those things, but they would also still be negotiating for a better deal than 19 hours that would serve your entire pilot group, not just a sub section of them.
04-07-2020, 11:33 AM
#427
In a land of unicorns
Joined APC: Apr 2014
Position: Whale FO
Posts: 6,470
Originally Posted by Cyio
Round 2? Didn’t you all just say they won’t even communicate right now?
04-07-2020, 11:34 AM
#428
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2017
Posts: 3,659
Originally Posted by martyByrde
The ironic part is, those jokers were telling us in the conference calls, the LOA, “wont cost us anything.” They seemed to forget about leverage.
04-07-2020, 11:34 AM
#429
In a land of unicorns
Joined APC: Apr 2014
Position: Whale FO
Posts: 6,470
Originally Posted by Cyio
Explain what I “made up”?
Status quo is great if you don’t mind exposing your family to higher risks of getting sick. Or if you can afford to live off less than minimum wage with the 19 hour deal.
I agree there wouldn’t be those things, but they would also still be negotiating for a better deal than 19 hours that would serve your entire pilot group, not just a sub section of them.
Status quo is great if you don’t mind exposing your family to higher risks of getting sick. Or if you can afford to live off less than minimum wage with the 19 hour deal.
I agree there wouldn’t be those things, but they would also still be negotiating for a better deal than 19 hours that would serve your entire pilot group, not just a sub section of them.
04-07-2020, 11:37 AM
#430
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2017
Posts: 3,659
Originally Posted by dera
The fact that you think they have enough takers for this CSLOA just shows your ignorance on what's going on. There will be round 2. If not, then we won.
Dera I know this is personal for you so I am going to walk away. I have stated my opinion many times and made it clear the company would behave just the way they have.
Time will tell and I sincerely hope I can come back on here sooner rather than later and admit how wrong I was.
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