The useful Envoy thread
#531
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Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 31
Likes: 0
Yeah...that will be the Great Lakes...sorry. Not where we need to go as a profession and not what will attract folks spending $150+ for ratings!
As for Bzzt and his "we don't have a pilot shortage"...yeah...we do. And yes, I've been in this industry long enough to have heard decades of the likes of Kit Darby saying it's coming. ALPA knows it but is positioning itself to see a consolidation. ALPA is also trying to protect (rightfully in my opinion at this point) the 1500 rule. And frankly, ALPA is a major airline union and until the majors have a hiring problem...ALPA won't see the problem.
As for our decision...it was the right one. So was ExpressJet/ASA and Republic. We need to get over this "we're a regional pilot so we're inferior "!@# stuff.
What's our power...stand up and say, "I'm a highly trained professional. I've spent untold years of training, thousands and thousands of dollars in education, and I deserve better". I WILL NOT ACCEPT POVERTY WAGES WITH A 10 YEAR TERM TO PERPETUATE THIS INDUSTRY.
You actually do have power...you have the skill that NOW is finally in demand. Time to insert a stiff piece of metal up the butt and demand, throughout this industry, that we are paid what we are worth. Good lord, I taught undergraduates that expected and GOT wages higher than our senior captains RIGHT OUT OF COLLEGE. The era of 50K being a high wage for a highly skilled, trained, college educated individual who has spent what we spend on education and a degree are OVER. NO kid these days is gonna put up with that (and I'm not a kid---wish I were in my 30's again)...neither should we.
As for Bzzt and his "we don't have a pilot shortage"...yeah...we do. And yes, I've been in this industry long enough to have heard decades of the likes of Kit Darby saying it's coming. ALPA knows it but is positioning itself to see a consolidation. ALPA is also trying to protect (rightfully in my opinion at this point) the 1500 rule. And frankly, ALPA is a major airline union and until the majors have a hiring problem...ALPA won't see the problem.
As for our decision...it was the right one. So was ExpressJet/ASA and Republic. We need to get over this "we're a regional pilot so we're inferior "!@# stuff.
What's our power...stand up and say, "I'm a highly trained professional. I've spent untold years of training, thousands and thousands of dollars in education, and I deserve better". I WILL NOT ACCEPT POVERTY WAGES WITH A 10 YEAR TERM TO PERPETUATE THIS INDUSTRY.
You actually do have power...you have the skill that NOW is finally in demand. Time to insert a stiff piece of metal up the butt and demand, throughout this industry, that we are paid what we are worth. Good lord, I taught undergraduates that expected and GOT wages higher than our senior captains RIGHT OUT OF COLLEGE. The era of 50K being a high wage for a highly skilled, trained, college educated individual who has spent what we spend on education and a degree are OVER. NO kid these days is gonna put up with that (and I'm not a kid---wish I were in my 30's again)...neither should we.
#532
Line Holder
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 31
Likes: 0
Envoy is and was too large for American to be a niche carrier. The pilot seniority list looks too much like a mainline carrier than the Republics and Compasses of the world. The best shot you have of being a niche carrier, in my opinion, is if the top half of the company retires or moves on. It is truly unfortunate that it's taken this long for things to start swinging back in the right direction. I feel bad for those who've been stranded and abandoned by this business starting in 2000. I can only hope Richard Anderson starts an exodus from the regionals.
Funny, the larger a carrier gets, the more likely these regional managements are to move the flying and break them down. Comair is a good example. WE are a good example...we're down about a 1/3 in 18 months! ExpressJet is about to be next (gee, wonder why)...for regional management, smaller means control.
RE: top of the list...that is what is going to kill us (and funny -- not ha ha funny) --- it's AA management's fault. Pay the top guys at least the DL wage, add a sign on bonus over two years or something so that our most senior 1/3 can move and sustain a career. THEN most of our costs would be decreased so as to be competitive. That won't happen and so I don't see any way for us to become the competitive model that for the short term these FFD contracts will demand (and this is what will hasten our demise AND every other regional FFD's demise). That's also why our AIP and management offers have been unconscionably long 10 year (equates to 14-15 year) duration. That is the only way management can spread their costs out long enough to make it work in the regional FFD model. They say it is airplane costs...no it isn't. If it were you'd see the same durations at RAH, etc. It's labor cost costs versus FFD payments. The Majors are squeezing them and they have nowhere else to go. Problem is not just one is being squeezed and the labor cost dynamics are changing. Hence --- in my humble opinion-- Richard Anderson's and Delta's move to change the FFD dynamic.
#533
Line Holder
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 31
Likes: 0
Envoy is and was too large for American to be a niche carrier. The pilot seniority list looks too much like a mainline carrier than the Republics and Compasses of the world. The best shot you have of being a niche carrier, in my opinion, is if the top half of the company retires or moves on. It is truly unfortunate that it's taken this long for things to start swinging back in the right direction. I feel bad for those who've been stranded and abandoned by this business starting in 2000. I can only hope Richard Anderson starts an exodus from the regionals.
o In May 2014, SkyWest announced Russell “Chip” Childs as President, SkyWest, Wade Steel EVP, SkyWest and Michael Thompson, COO, SkyWest Airlines
o In the second half of 2014, SkyWest expects 56 of its unprofitable 50-seat aircraft contracts will naturally expire and the aircraft will be returned to lessors. SkyWest also expects an additional 101 unprofitable 50-seat aircraft contracts will naturally expire and be removed from service by December 31, 2015.
o SkyWest added eight E175 regional jet aircraft as of June 30, 2014, expects delivery of 13 additional E175 aircraft by December 31, 2014 and the remaining 19 additional aircraft by August 2015. With the training and other start-up costs associated with the E175 aircraft launch, SkyWest anticipates the economic benefit of the E175 aircraft will become evident by the second quarter of 2015.
o SkyWest invested approximately $26.8 million for E175 specific spare parts, engines and tooling as of June 30, 2014 and anticipates investing another $10.0-$12.0 million for similar items by the end of 2014. SkyWest also invested $33.6 million into E175 ownership equity as of June 30, 2014.
see:
SkyWest, Inc.
I simply am quoting from a financial statement which is consistent with Delta's CEO announcement tonight. If you have other information, quote it here and quote your source.
#534
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,648
Likes: 0
Envoy is and was too large for American to be a niche carrier. The pilot seniority list looks too much like a mainline carrier than the Republics and Compasses of the world. The best shot you have of being a niche carrier, in my opinion, is if the top half of the company retires or moves on. It is truly unfortunate that it's taken this long for things to start swinging back in the right direction. I feel bad for those who've been stranded and abandoned by this business starting in 2000. I can only hope Richard Anderson starts an exodus from the regionals.
#535
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 484
Likes: 0
2014 and the first half of 2015 will be a significant transition period for SkyWest, and to address the challenges we have made key leadership changes and fleet changes, such as:
o In May 2014, SkyWest announced Russell “Chip” Childs as President, SkyWest, Wade Steel EVP, SkyWest and Michael Thompson, COO, SkyWest Airlines
o In the second half of 2014, SkyWest expects 56 of its unprofitable 50-seat aircraft contracts will naturally expire and the aircraft will be returned to lessors. SkyWest also expects an additional 101 unprofitable 50-seat aircraft contracts will naturally expire and be removed from service by December 31, 2015.
o SkyWest added eight E175 regional jet aircraft as of June 30, 2014, expects delivery of 13 additional E175 aircraft by December 31, 2014 and the remaining 19 additional aircraft by August 2015. With the training and other start-up costs associated with the E175 aircraft launch, SkyWest anticipates the economic benefit of the E175 aircraft will become evident by the second quarter of 2015.
o SkyWest invested approximately $26.8 million for E175 specific spare parts, engines and tooling as of June 30, 2014 and anticipates investing another $10.0-$12.0 million for similar items by the end of 2014. SkyWest also invested $33.6 million into E175 ownership equity as of June 30, 2014.
see:
SkyWest, Inc.
I simply am quoting from a financial statement which is consistent with Delta's CEO announcement tonight. If you have other information, quote it here and quote your source.
o In May 2014, SkyWest announced Russell “Chip” Childs as President, SkyWest, Wade Steel EVP, SkyWest and Michael Thompson, COO, SkyWest Airlines
o In the second half of 2014, SkyWest expects 56 of its unprofitable 50-seat aircraft contracts will naturally expire and the aircraft will be returned to lessors. SkyWest also expects an additional 101 unprofitable 50-seat aircraft contracts will naturally expire and be removed from service by December 31, 2015.
o SkyWest added eight E175 regional jet aircraft as of June 30, 2014, expects delivery of 13 additional E175 aircraft by December 31, 2014 and the remaining 19 additional aircraft by August 2015. With the training and other start-up costs associated with the E175 aircraft launch, SkyWest anticipates the economic benefit of the E175 aircraft will become evident by the second quarter of 2015.
o SkyWest invested approximately $26.8 million for E175 specific spare parts, engines and tooling as of June 30, 2014 and anticipates investing another $10.0-$12.0 million for similar items by the end of 2014. SkyWest also invested $33.6 million into E175 ownership equity as of June 30, 2014.
see:
SkyWest, Inc.
I simply am quoting from a financial statement which is consistent with Delta's CEO announcement tonight. If you have other information, quote it here and quote your source.
From internal communications today.
" Specifically at SkyWest Airlines, a total of four CRJ200s will be removed from service through the end of this year, and an additional 22 CRJ200s will come off contract in 2015.
To recap some of the previous conversations we’ve had about our fleet, in 2012 we made an agreement with Delta to remove 66 CRJ200 aircraft for the addition of 34 CRJ900 aircraft. The 3 CRJ200s we’ll remove in 2014 (and 1 CRJ200 in Jan. 2015) mark the completion of that agreement with Delta."
#536
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 332
Likes: 0
Oh this has got to be the case. There cannot be two them like this!
#537
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 3,157
Likes: 20
Yeah...that will be the Great Lakes...sorry. Not where we need to go as a profession and not what will attract folks spending $150+ for ratings!
As for Bzzt and his "we don't have a pilot shortage"...yeah...we do. And yes, I've been in this industry long enough to have heard decades of the likes of Kit Darby saying it's coming. ALPA knows it but is positioning itself to see a consolidation. ALPA is also trying to protect (rightfully in my opinion at this point) the 1500 rule. And frankly, ALPA is a major airline union and until the majors have a hiring problem...ALPA won't see the problem.
As for our decision...it was the right one. So was ExpressJet/ASA and Republic. We need to get over this "we're a regional pilot so we're inferior "!@# stuff.
What's our power...stand up and say, "I'm a highly trained professional. I've spent untold years of training, thousands and thousands of dollars in education, and I deserve better". I WILL NOT ACCEPT POVERTY WAGES WITH A 10 YEAR TERM TO PERPETUATE THIS INDUSTRY.
You actually do have power...you have the skill that NOW is finally in demand. Time to insert a stiff piece of metal up the butt and demand, throughout this industry, that we are paid what we are worth. Good lord, I taught undergraduates that expected and GOT wages higher than our senior captains RIGHT OUT OF COLLEGE. The era of 50K being a high wage for a highly skilled, trained, college educated individual who has spent what we spend on education and a degree are OVER. NO kid these days is gonna put up with that (and I'm not a kid---wish I were in my 30's again)...neither should we.
As for Bzzt and his "we don't have a pilot shortage"...yeah...we do. And yes, I've been in this industry long enough to have heard decades of the likes of Kit Darby saying it's coming. ALPA knows it but is positioning itself to see a consolidation. ALPA is also trying to protect (rightfully in my opinion at this point) the 1500 rule. And frankly, ALPA is a major airline union and until the majors have a hiring problem...ALPA won't see the problem.
As for our decision...it was the right one. So was ExpressJet/ASA and Republic. We need to get over this "we're a regional pilot so we're inferior "!@# stuff.
What's our power...stand up and say, "I'm a highly trained professional. I've spent untold years of training, thousands and thousands of dollars in education, and I deserve better". I WILL NOT ACCEPT POVERTY WAGES WITH A 10 YEAR TERM TO PERPETUATE THIS INDUSTRY.
You actually do have power...you have the skill that NOW is finally in demand. Time to insert a stiff piece of metal up the butt and demand, throughout this industry, that we are paid what we are worth. Good lord, I taught undergraduates that expected and GOT wages higher than our senior captains RIGHT OUT OF COLLEGE. The era of 50K being a high wage for a highly skilled, trained, college educated individual who has spent what we spend on education and a degree are OVER. NO kid these days is gonna put up with that (and I'm not a kid---wish I were in my 30's again)...neither should we.
#538
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,648
Likes: 0
Not all regional pilots, some of us don't want to be permanently junior at an enormous legacy airline.
#539
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Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 115
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Regional pilots currently have to compete against corporate and military guys for spots at the majors. If regionals don't exist, once you're on a legacy's list, any military or corporate guy that gets hired is going to be below you.
You won't spend wasted years accruing seniority at an airline you'll eventually leave for a legacy.
#540
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 833
Likes: 0
From: Feito no Brasil, CA
Nice assumptions. Hypothetically, just because regionals cease to exist does not magically transport everyone to a major airline seniority list. There will be those left to the street and the pool of available jobs for everyone interested in an airline career will drastically shrink. It's nice to skip to the finish in a story, but the fallout to get there can't be ignored.
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