Originally Posted by Archy Meatpants

Envoy has two year upgrade and thats pretty steadfast, but it’s an 8 year flow. Not the 6 they advertise to AA.

My advice...go to Envoy. You’re hurting more than yourself by coming to XJT. Hope that helps.

Originally Posted by Baradium

Envoy doesn't have a 2 year upgrade. If you visit their forum they have forced upgrades as soon as you reach minimums. Which means you're going to NYC too.

Originally Posted by DirkDiggler

Don’t go to a United Express carrier. None of them, not Trans States, CommutAir or ExpressJet. Unless you enjoy a nice daily golden shower. If you want pay, go to Endeavor. If you want career progression, go to an AA wholly owned. If you want to get urinated on, go to an UAX carrier.

Originally Posted by AboveMins

Dirk sums it up perfectly. Best decision I've ever made was getting as far from the UAX system as possible. Don't bother with the CPP either. There's so many gotchas embedded in it. It's not worth the toilet paper it's written on.

Originally Posted by CessnaGril

Can they force an upgrade, if you don't bid it?
What if the pilot wants more experience first ?

Originally Posted by Archy Meatpants

That’s good IAH is close. Makes it a whole nother job. The career pathway program (please don’t call it a flow, it’s far from it) is BS. It has the opportunity to get very senior guys and the lucky handful of FOs out to UA for the final decade or less of their life as a pilot, but I wouldn’t count on it for new hires.

Yes, we have a great contract that the company constantly tries to violate. It’s a good contract but it has become more of the norm around the industry. The company likes to tout that it is industry leading. And it was. In 2004. Now it’s pretty standard. As far as treated well...gotta be honest I almost spit my drink out in laughter.

That recruiter told you he doesn’t need to upgrade because he doesn’t. He makes plenty being a recruiter. Good QOL and will move on when he has to. That “just get your 1000 FO and go to UA” is ridiculous. I have 3000 with the company, it doesn’t matter. And yes, you need a four year degree for the CPP.

Envoy has two year upgrade and thats pretty steadfast, but it’s an 8 year flow. Not the 6 they advertise to AA.

My advice...go to Envoy. You’re hurting more than yourself by coming to XJT. Hope that helps.

Originally Posted by Knobcrk1

Your friends would have been in an Airbus or 737 from another airline long before your flow date came up at the WO. Spirit now pays the same as a AA Airbus pilot.

Originally Posted by Baradium

Check out their forum, but according to pilots there, Envoy has a provision in their contract that allows displacement TO captain. The company has thus been displacing all FOs on property that meet minimums to CA each vacancy (because they have so many that do not). To make it even better, apparently they even will "displace" new hires when they choose a/c in indoc. In that case those with the time are simply told they are choosing the CA slots available. For new hires or junior F/Os this apparently results in LGA 145 CA and perpetual reserve.

Originally Posted by SkipperBaloo

Their 145s and 200s are going to look good parked on ramps around the country because they won't be out flying much longer with nothing to offer the pilots that fly them

Originally Posted by AboveMins

Bingo. UAL, Delta, and ScumWest Inc can clean up the mess. I just heard today from someone that the active pilot list on the CRJ side is hovering around 500 pilots. I think that the ERJ is at about 1300 pilots with 430 on leave (my last check), so that leaves about 870 total active. Yeah, summer staffing is going to get really interesting. Terry better go get his type and hit the line with the rest of the SGU puppets, they're gonna need all hands on deck.