WHACKMASTER

Nevermind feeling insecure about the safety aspect of inexperienced RJ pilots operating widebodies on long-haul routes. How about feeling insecure about our well paying jobs on this side of the pond going bye bye forever thanks to this FOC NAI scam.

I don't think you get it. We don't want what you're selling and we WILL do what we can to get rid of this cancer if at all possible in order to protect the types of jobs that young entrants into this profession can aspire to.

Making in the low 100s as an Airbus Cptn while working 18 days a month is NOT that kind of job. Good for you if you're content with it but you can keep it. Your NAI cheerleading and justifying is falling on deaf ears.

Sniper66

As far as NEdude

Ignore Him is the best thing you can do
He is the biggest tool on this forum

Qotsaautopilot

Is it possible to live the life I described as an airline pilot in Europe? My understanding is that most US FOs make more than European captains. The life I described requires making $300k/yr with 16% on top of that being dropped into your retirement account and having the time off to enjoy that income. This is becoming pretty standard for 12 yr+ captains in the US.

Sure I like flying but I got in to this career to get rich. Maybe not filthy rich to where I have no clue how much money I actually have and pay people to wipe my own ass but rich enough to be able to buy most things and not worry about. If this career cannot provide that why not do something else and fly as a hobby. You think a gynecologist likes looking at roughed up muff day in and day out? He does it because he gets rich from it.

$100-150k is sadly a decent living in most parts of the US because most companies have put so much pressure on wages. With that money you're getting by but still have to budget and stick pretty close to it if you have a family of four or more. It's possible to be content I suppose so I see your point. FOs making half that have to have a second income coming into the family. That puts ridiculous stress on the marriage if you're gone 18-20 days a month. Frankly it doesn't even come close to making the job worth it. It's for a kid in his early 20s with no family. That's a job not a career and if your job cannot become a career it's a dead end job.

Last point being that so many jobs are so volatile that eventually you will find yourself without one and if you weren't making enough money in the good times to be stashing away some serious rainy day money then you are going to be in a world of hurt. In 2016 making $100-150k with a family in most major domicile does not allow you to do that

Jaded N Cynical

Anyone consider that NAI is hiring US pilots to get the operation going? To quell the opposition by hiring US pilots. 3 years down the road they can fire or NOT renew the contracts of those "expensive" US pilots and shift the pilot labor to Asian contracts?

Anyone applying is fooling themselves thinking this will be a career. Don't sell yourselves short.

bay982

NEdude provides an opinion, along with facts to support his argument. His discussion is incomparably superior to that of someone who calls people a 'tool'

iceman49

Exactly, they are not entry level requirements, but they want to pay substantially below what that aircraft should pay. Sorry 400 hours don't cut it.

Beretta01

My thoughts exactly. I love all of the pro-NAI guys in here that are all gung-ho about working for "NAI".....you're not working for NAI, you're working for OSM Aviation, you *******ing sellouts.

jcountry

Tell that to the families of the Helios victims and the Air France 447 victims, etc.

Incompetent pilots killed every one on those planes.

NEDude

I would be happy to tell them that because it is a fact. The accident rate is not zero, not even in the U.S.

NEDude

Just a quick summary:

NAI is not a true 'flag of convenience' scheme because Ireland is a part of the European Union, meaning Norwegian is unable to skirt EU/EEA laws by starting a subsidiary in Ireland. Calling it a 'flag of convenience' also ignores the fact that pilots are also covered under the laws of the nation of their contract (which is Norway or the UK - NOT Singapore as ALPA claims), the nation where they are based, and the nation where the aircraft they are on is registered (ALL Norwegian aircraft are registered in Norway or the EU).

Starting or owning a subsidiary airline in another EU/EEA nation is not new and is not unique to Norwegian. Lufthansa, IAG (British Airways-Iberia), easyJet, and Thomas Cook, to name a few, own and operate subsidiary airlines in nations outside of where their main headquarters is. Most of the subsidiary airlines hold US DOT approval.

The use of contract employees is not new or unique to Norwegian and it is a common practice in many parts of the world. Brussels Airlines, WOW Air, Korean Air, Air China and many others make use of contract pilots and also hold US DOT approval.

Norwegian is an average paying job for the European market. Eurowings, a Lufthansa alter-ego airline which flies to 3 US destinations, pays 15% less for wide body pilots than Norwegian. Where is the ALPA outrage over that - an alter-ego airline significantly undercutting even the LCCs and competing against ALPA carriers?

Legal experts for the authorities on both sides of the Atlantic have examined the 'Open Skies' treaty as it relates to NAI and ALL OF THEM have concluded there is no legal basis for denying, or as the case is now, revoking the operating certificate of NAI. Revoking a legally issued operating certificate on zero legal grounds would only serve to start an aviation trade war between the nations of the Open Skies treaty. Who do you think would benefit from that? You are a fool if you think such a dispute would be beneficial to the careers of U.S. pilots.

If pointing out those facts makes me a tool, then so be it. But ignoring those facts and blindly following the ALPA propaganda makes the rest of you fools.