germanaviator

I can't agree. A lot of things beyond pay are better at NJA, in my opinion. Your default roster is a 7/7. In Europe it's 6/5 on every fleet but the Global where it is 7/6. When we take seven days vacation we do NOT get 21 days away from work like someone at NJA on the 7/7 does. We get an eleven day break when we take seven days vacation. Sixteen when we take ten. And we cannot book more than that in the summer. We have less access to part time (such as your CC52) and it's not awarded by seniority. Neither is vacation. Your tour based pay comes without strings attached and is year-round. Ours is only four to six months per year and you have to give up something in order to qualify. Ok, that last one was pay-related. Yes, we do have more restrictive flight duty and rest rules but we frequently fly long days (12+ hours) just like you guys. 60 hours duty in 6 days is the legal limit but also the target for NJE scheduling. And it can be exceeded on the last day while airlining home (with agreement of the crew member). I'm pretty sure we use the same fatigue risk management system in i-jet as you guys. Three or four legs a day are standard. Five are very rare. Yes, I think you guys are a more productive in terms of hours flown per day but I think flying domestic in the U.S. is significantly easier than flying intra-Europe. Here there is no single airspace sytem, single level of ATC, not a decent FBO at every airport. In Europe airport slots at every major airport are a given as are air traffic control slots (CTOTs) similar to your EDCTs. But here they are the rule during most of summer and peak days whilst in the U.S. they are relatively rare and usually limited to a certain geographic operating area such as Florida around Christmas. Italian, Spanish, Greek, French etc ATC is not the same as the service you get in the States. Oh, and there is airport security everywhere, even at FBOs. What a pain. I'm not saying the job at NJA is easy. I'm sure some days it can be harder than at NJE. But I'm pretty sure overall NJA is the better job.

Das Auto

Here's the problem with your post. Apart from the loss of "fun factor," you failed to mention any positives from private aviation vs 121, and half the stuff you mentioned I have never done or seen anyone else do for that matter. Wobbly ladder on an icy ramp. Nope. Pulling a suitcase lav? All of the airplanes in the NetJets fleet have external servicing, just like your 737 or A320, and what's the difference between asking the FBO counter for your release vs the gate agent?
Sure I've loaded bags and checked ID's but so far neither have caused any PTSD.

How does the health insurance compare? Do you have an app on your phone where you can order four meals a day from an extensive menu and have them delivered at a time and place of your choosing, or do you stand in line at Wendy's with the MCO crowd? Does your LCC have Durango CO as a base or do you have to commute to LGA, DET or some other lovely place on your own time?

There are pros and cons, but insignificant inconveniences like using the same bathroom as the passengers (which you also do on an airliner) shouldn't be a deal breaker. Sounds like rationalizing to me.

Pervis

Well Das, I guess you never dealt with an Ultra. Many FBOs refused to pull the honey pot through the cabin. Even us large cabin folks deal with those rickety ladders today pulling the forward battery at the end of the day. Or dealt with restocking the aircraft as you crewmate wiped down a toilet and vacuumed the floor. All before you pinned the gear and pitot covers, and sometimes engine covers in 30 kt winds.

Extensive menus? We used to order anything we wanted. Guess you didn’t experience that either. What you see now is the result of years of effort to retain what we do have. Much better pay, great health care, crew cars, travel on company time and dime, great hotels, and tons of other bennies. Trouble is what some see as “better than others” tend to learn the hard way of changes they never thought could happen. Don’t get me wrong. I am darn proud of what we have and what we accomplished. Just be careful not to blow your horn too loud. Ask the Pan Am, Braniff, Eastern, TWA, etc folks how proud they are now. And btw, Wendy’s is a heck of a lot more reliable than some of our caterers.

Brickhut

Before we continue, can I ask your time at NJ, equipment, and seat?

Brickhut

Don't forget the BeechJet! I flew the Ultra for 9 years, man that plane gives me PTSD! That "baggage compartment". I firmly believe that NJ is the absolute best gig in the private aviation realm, but, as you know, you do have to work a bit harder/down on your knees, so to speak. And being a 121 guy now, I could easily be brushing up on BranAmWorld unemployment 101 at any given moment. Great post, Pervis. Fly wherever makes you happy and pays the bills!

sky303

Funny enough, a lot of the negatives of fracs listed by the poster a few above are basically associated with providing quality customer service. I have always been passionate about customer service and have loved working in fine dining, customer service standardization, auditing, writing, etc. When I got into flying I assumed I would follow the usual airline path, but stumbled into a charter gig and realized it married my passions for flying and customer service. To me, greeting and treating passengers with care, remembering a favorite drink, and arranging transportation are parts of the job I enjoy immensely. Getting to know someone and executing on things that ensure that person enjoys the experience for which they are paying is gratifying to me. Hard to explain, but I guess this work scratches both of my itches—flying and customer service. I don’t view those tasks as negatives, in fact, quite the opposite.

Different strokes for different folks!

Brickhut

As someone who did the same thing for 12 years, I can empathize with your willingness to go above and beyond. Customer service is in my blood. I'm guessing, however, like "Das Auto" above, you've never worked for a major? All that is expected of you is to show up, turn left, fly airplane, go home. I'll admit, after 12 years as a 135/91 Barbie Jet driver, it was hard to "slow down" to the speed of the 121 world, but after a year or two, you begin to realize just how much extra effort you had to put in for less pay and less QOL. Your noble customer service heroism is appreciated at your current place of employment, but I can't tell you how nice it feels to truly not give a flying F#$k what happens behind a closed and locked cockpit door. Hopefully, someday, you'll get to experience it.

avi8er

i bet Netjets love to have 2500 of you. Heck, you are doing the job of many for the price of one!

FNGFO

Nothing you listed there is the hard part. Loading bags in sweltering heat, rain or miserable cold is. Being stooped over the entire time you’re in the jet while you clean, stock and handle the lav is. Doing it 3-5 times a day is. Doing it 5-8 days at time is.

I’d still be a frac pilot if remembering so and so likes iced coffee was the hard part.

I’ll never forget what a former Delta guy told me as we were trying to squeeze 9 people’s worth of bags into a baggage compartment on a summer day. “Do you really want to be doing this when you’re 65?”

No. I miss the fun flying. I miss the hotel points and airline miles. I miss some of the great people I worked with. I do not miss being a fractional pilot. Because being a pilot is only about 1/3 of the job, and the rest is not something you’ll ever see anybody advertising to new flight school applicants.

germanaviator

Pretty much spot on. I too enjoy providing great customer service but a lot of the stuff we have to do before the pax arrive and after they have left is not part of the enjoyment. If we did one or two flights a day then it would be a lot less painful but at production line pace it can get old quickly.