Frontier Negotiations Discussion
11-09-2018 | 08:24 PM
#3111
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 461
Likes: 0
I’ve got to get off here, but before I go, the shamefulness hasn’t even begun yet. Industry bottom absof’nlutely everything and the MEC is going to play this like pbs is a GAIN. I’ve said my piece enough. Very disappointed in our union. Ya’ll take care. I hope we do the right thing.
11-09-2018 | 08:27 PM
#3112
Line Holder
Joined: Aug 2016
Posts: 730
Likes: 22
From: Bus CA
Might be time for some custom lanyards
Vote “NO” to TA 2018. Show me the Money!
I hate lanyards but I’ve worn the orange one and I would wear this one. There must be a way to get these made and distributed.
I hate lanyards but I’ve worn the orange one and I would wear this one. There must be a way to get these made and distributed.
11-09-2018 | 08:33 PM
#3113
Line Holder
Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 65
Likes: 0
From: MCO 320 ca
Copy, industry bottom everything is good with you. Hey, we’ll cancel each other out! Not a 428xxx btw.
If you’re a 428, it’s not too late! Vote no and pass go. 429? It’s fine if you don’t sign! Vote no!
*Bring a screen shot of your no vote and all sins will be forgiven.
If you’re a 428, it’s not too late! Vote no and pass go. 429? It’s fine if you don’t sign! Vote no!
*Bring a screen shot of your no vote and all sins will be forgiven.
If you a 429, get out of line.
11-09-2018 | 09:47 PM
#3116
Line Holder
Joined: Apr 2016
Posts: 332
Likes: 6
Very, very, very disappointing!!
This is insulting!! They worked how long and hard just to cave!!!
It’s up to us now!!!
This has to go down in flames!!! 90+%
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=cMTAUr3Nm6I
This is insulting!! They worked how long and hard just to cave!!!
It’s up to us now!!!
This has to go down in flames!!! 90+%
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=cMTAUr3Nm6I
11-09-2018 | 09:53 PM
#3117
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 127
Likes: 0
From: A320
11-09-2018 | 10:01 PM
#3118
Thread Starter
Line Holder
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 1,989
Likes: 112
From: Lineholder
3 things:
First of all, who takes the first offer in a negotiation?
Second, I realize these were bullets, but there are SO MANY other areas that weren't addressed. LOA 67 for instance - is that what the $75 mil is for? Were there any substantial scope language changes? What exactly does increased union involvement in scheduling mean? What are the specific rules associated w/ PBS implementation? Can we drop down to zero?
Third, and certainly not least, our NC realizes our original ask (which by the time the company actually started to negotiate for real NK and JB had new contracts) was OBE. It was considered bad negotation practice to up our ask (especially on items already supposedly TAd) so they had no choice but to accept the 1st "reasonable" offer and pass it to us. I think their hopes are for us to vote this down w/ some significance (say >75%). When that happens, they can go back w/ the ammo/backing of our vote and up our ask to something more realistic. It is a risk, but they're giving us the chance to vote is THEIR confidence in us as a group - which I applaud.
Now, it's time we do our job. Send this PoS back for round 2.
First of all, who takes the first offer in a negotiation?
Second, I realize these were bullets, but there are SO MANY other areas that weren't addressed. LOA 67 for instance - is that what the $75 mil is for? Were there any substantial scope language changes? What exactly does increased union involvement in scheduling mean? What are the specific rules associated w/ PBS implementation? Can we drop down to zero?
Third, and certainly not least, our NC realizes our original ask (which by the time the company actually started to negotiate for real NK and JB had new contracts) was OBE. It was considered bad negotation practice to up our ask (especially on items already supposedly TAd) so they had no choice but to accept the 1st "reasonable" offer and pass it to us. I think their hopes are for us to vote this down w/ some significance (say >75%). When that happens, they can go back w/ the ammo/backing of our vote and up our ask to something more realistic. It is a risk, but they're giving us the chance to vote is THEIR confidence in us as a group - which I applaud.
Now, it's time we do our job. Send this PoS back for round 2.
11-09-2018 | 10:26 PM
#3119
On Reserve
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 113
Likes: 0
From: Fighting the Good fight
Already told my rep to vote no.
Here’s why...
No min day. Min duty period not good enough. 32 hour sit in Cincinasty?? Tiny rig for you. You’ll still see plenty of sub 20 hour 4 day trips.
20frickin22 before a 15% match???? you have to be joking! Two words, compound interest.
I don’t want to see a crappy TA. Don’t even put it to the pilot group if this is what they have agreed to. We need to get a contract to make us even with our peers, not a contract that’s simply a little better than what we have now.
Here’s why...
No min day. Min duty period not good enough. 32 hour sit in Cincinasty?? Tiny rig for you. You’ll still see plenty of sub 20 hour 4 day trips.
20frickin22 before a 15% match???? you have to be joking! Two words, compound interest.
I don’t want to see a crappy TA. Don’t even put it to the pilot group if this is what they have agreed to. We need to get a contract to make us even with our peers, not a contract that’s simply a little better than what we have now.
Let’s look at some real numbers of this vs JB.
I used 75 hrs a month credit, and the 12% F9 DC vs JB 15%, 2.35 vs 2.00 per diem at 280 TAFB. I don’t know the cost of the health care so cannot compare there.
The LTD is 13.5k vs 8k. The list goes on and on!
The Pay, DC, and per diem where I would fall (even using the March rates) puts me behind our brothers at JB $35,905 a year. The first year. Yeah it goes down a little due to slope, but that’s enough to pay straight up for a year of college that we are leaving on the table. EVERY YEAR FOR REALISTICALLY 8 YEARS!
YGTBSM!
Grab a pen and paper and figure out how much more you all would be getting forked by Indigo.
I used 75 hrs a month credit, and the 12% F9 DC vs JB 15%, 2.35 vs 2.00 per diem at 280 TAFB. I don’t know the cost of the health care so cannot compare there.
The LTD is 13.5k vs 8k. The list goes on and on!
The Pay, DC, and per diem where I would fall (even using the March rates) puts me behind our brothers at JB $35,905 a year. The first year. Yeah it goes down a little due to slope, but that’s enough to pay straight up for a year of college that we are leaving on the table. EVERY YEAR FOR REALISTICALLY 8 YEARS!
YGTBSM!
Grab a pen and paper and figure out how much more you all would be getting forked by Indigo.
SHAME on the NC.
SHAME on ALPA, our Trusted Advisors.
SHAME on the MEC, if you think this is acceptable to the pilot group.
Bottom to Bottom is NOT Acceptable. If we wanted this SH!T we could have had this months earlier.
Not now. Not After the sacrifice of our time - YEARS.. Time has a price. 75 mil now to have a concessionary contract with SH!TY work Rules all round. -NO Way.
YOU people have this ALL WRONG.. the market Favors labor/pilots now.. We're not a dime a dozen any more. We are in Demand.
The pilot group demands Nothing more than what is FAIR. Nothing in these Bullet points, points to ANYTHING that is fair, based on the current market, our time in fruitless negotiations, and Our Daily suffering.
The TA'd items were fine back in the day; however today is today, and they must be adjusted for currency.
NC, don't forget that PBS was one of the THREE TOP NO Votes for the Entire pilot group in the polls. To see it included in any further contract agreement makes any member wonder who your negotiating for.
A simple message to ALPA and the NC - Wrap It up. And as far as Your Remedy - Not Even Close....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j-emlb2_jdI
Get Your Sh!t together. there are 1200+ F9 pilots counting on YOU.
11-10-2018 | 03:43 AM
#3120
Line Holder
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 1,674
Likes: 0
Copy, industry bottom everything is good with you. Hey, we’ll cancel each other out! Not a 428xxx btw.
If you’re a 428, it’s not too late! Vote no and pass go. 429? It’s fine if you don’t sign! Vote no!
*Bring a screen shot of your no vote and all sins will be forgiven.
If you’re a 428, it’s not too late! Vote no and pass go. 429? It’s fine if you don’t sign! Vote no!
*Bring a screen shot of your no vote and all sins will be forgiven.
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