Positives and Negatives
12-16-2018, 09:08 AM
#171
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2018
Posts: 109
Granted, there is ‘no-furlough’ language regarding marketing agreements, but there is the potential for flat or no growth while unlimited numbers of 90 and 100 seat RJs haul Frontier customers.[L
One of our few scope protections in this TA is growth stagnation. That doesn’t sound industry leading.
12-16-2018, 10:36 AM
#172
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2014
Position: Lineholder
Posts: 1,363
Great point! I was so sure this TA was going to get voted down that I forgot to raise this concern. Most guys I meet are No voters but there are a few who only care about $$$$.
One of our few scope protections in this TA is growth stagnation. That doesn’t sound industry leading.
One of our few scope protections in this TA is growth stagnation. That doesn’t sound industry leading.
It is.
This will be voted down by a fairly large percentage...
12-16-2018, 11:44 AM
#176
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2014
Position: Lineholder
Posts: 1,363
Smh...you’re trying way to hard to be convincing.
The math just doesn’t bear out. If this contract is in any way appealing, it’s to those who will get to or are already above 12 years during the contract term and there are far more who won’t get to 10+ years during this contract then those who will. I’m not sure if there will be a breakout of year groups but it might be surprising to see more than 1 or 2% of guys who have 5 years or less on property that will vote yes. That’s a lot of NOs.
And for those who will get to 12, ALL those guys were here before Indigo and remember being on top of the pay and QoL scale. To think you got a lot of Yes votes from them is very presumptuous and disrespectful.
That leaves few and far between who will be voting yes.
Only people on here expecting a passage are the MEC, mgt and a few stragglers who don’t really value their worth or got scared because of some non-applicable calculator someone derived.
The math just doesn’t bear out. If this contract is in any way appealing, it’s to those who will get to or are already above 12 years during the contract term and there are far more who won’t get to 10+ years during this contract then those who will. I’m not sure if there will be a breakout of year groups but it might be surprising to see more than 1 or 2% of guys who have 5 years or less on property that will vote yes. That’s a lot of NOs.
And for those who will get to 12, ALL those guys were here before Indigo and remember being on top of the pay and QoL scale. To think you got a lot of Yes votes from them is very presumptuous and disrespectful.
That leaves few and far between who will be voting yes.
Only people on here expecting a passage are the MEC, mgt and a few stragglers who don’t really value their worth or got scared because of some non-applicable calculator someone derived.
12-16-2018, 12:35 PM
#178
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2018
Posts: 380
Actually, their PBS LOA and our PBS LOA are almost identical with a few large differences.
1. They hadn't chosen a vendor prior to DOS.
2. There wasn't any language in the Spirit LOA about ALPA control of the software
3. They didn't tie their arbitrator to other Navtech carriers (presumably because they hadn't picked one yet)
4. A lot of their work rule improvements were tied to PBS implementation
5. They only have a 4 hour vacation day vs our 5 hour.
They cannot reassign you using ACARS. It has to be PTC or self-notification through the future app. The difference between now and new book is you will be required to be contactable during your trip, just like most other carriers out there.
1. They hadn't chosen a vendor prior to DOS.
2. There wasn't any language in the Spirit LOA about ALPA control of the software
3. They didn't tie their arbitrator to other Navtech carriers (presumably because they hadn't picked one yet)
4. A lot of their work rule improvements were tied to PBS implementation
5. They only have a 4 hour vacation day vs our 5 hour.
They cannot reassign you using ACARS. It has to be PTC or self-notification through the future app. The difference between now and new book is you will be required to be contactable during your trip, just like most other carriers out there.
12-16-2018, 01:10 PM
#180
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2018
Posts: 109
If I remember correctly, there’s a provision for those who don’t wish to download the app. My vote switched to “NO” after reading the reassignment language.
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