fivebyfive

That's what mgmt and your NC would like you to believe. But it doesn't have to be that way. Times change and so should your mindset.

Beesknees

exactly! Why not push for equal pay. Don’t give up before we even start.

av8nallday

Oh I’m not giving up. But the reality is how far are we as a pilot group willing to stand our ground? Now with all these readjustments with bases and flying. I mean when’s the last time a legacy closed bases or opened bases then threw a curve ball to all the pilots and pulled 90% day turns? Talk about not having a finger on the pulse. Sure some guys will love the day turn aspects but commuters who came here wanting to stay here for the QOL and the pilot group as a whole just got boned hard. Anyone who has ever been in a crash pad knows that takes a hit on QOL and on top of that now we will need to spend every night back in one. I don’t buy BL or BB saying some bases will still have multi day trips. He will say anything to not cause a mass exodus. Sure it may be the case for a time but then again what do I know I’m not a bean counter. All of this from a guy who came to frontier from a regional knowing it’s not some sexy legacy and I wasn’t going to be making a billion dollars being perfectly content with that. Now I’m starting to wonder if the rest of my career is worth the gamble whether this company is worth the gamble. Everyone wants to say well do you really want to join the bottom of a 16000 pilot SL? No not really but let’s also not forget they wanted to furlough 750 guys during covid. I don’t have a crystal ball and I sure don’t have all the info but at some point when looking in the mirror you gotta ask yourself is this worth all the BS and the what ifs/stress of knowing the government doesn’t give two sh!ts if we fail. Just my humble opinion. Like I said I don’t know what the right answer is but I am questioning if this place is worth the reasons I came here planning on retiring here anymore.

buzzer

Good post. Couple of my opinions on the above. The union will need to be strong and galvanize the group. I'm not seeing that so far. The pilot group as a whole isn't giving the company any reason to be anywhere near signing a contract. I think there will have to be a grassroots effort unless mgt ****es off everyone a lot more. Most all airline executives in BL or BB's postion will say what the need to say. Maybe more of this BS with BL or BB. Agree its a big gamble at F9. Based on retirements, being at the bottom of 16,000 at this time will still net you upward movement (no guarantee) with a much higher level of confidence of job security and stabilty than at F9 right now. And yes, 100%, the government is boxed in to protecting the "Majors" even if they don't give a ****...not so at F9.

Dragonslayer69

It seems a ULCC, at least according to BB, means run the airline as lean as possible until the engine starts to sputter then back it off just a hair. Just enough to keep things somewhat functional. With that philosophy I wonder f the union and F9 could ever see eye to eye. I wonder if negotiations could reach a point where Indigo just says, ""F" it. Pull the plug, liquidate the assets, write it off on our taxes and let's look for the next investment."

spooldup

They have made WAY too much money to do that anywhere near the future, they continuously make money also, even if they have been a little low in some of the past quarters.

Dragonslayer69

The way BB wants to run a ULCC can't support a Delta like contract. Not even close.

TOGALOCK

Those same thoughts existed during the last round of negotiations for the current contract. The argument being that Indigo has already earned their investment back tenfold.

The other side of that coin is that there is quite literally nothing to liquidate. Frontier Airlines is a paper airline without any real assets. The name exists on an ops certificate and decaled on the side of the planes. Beyond that, everything Frontier has is either leased, rented, or borrowed. Closing shop overnight would cost them a significant amount of money for broken lease agreements, etc.

If Indigo wanted out, they would likely sell it off… and it would be to another investment group. That could mean good things, or it could make you actually miss Indigo. Heck, it could be to Sunseeker and, compared to the Allegiant contract, the current F9 contract looks like Delta’s.

Dragonslayer69

That gives me the warm fuzzies. Precisely what I envisioned when I made the career change to airline pilot.

hercretired

They do?

Where is this documented?

Who says "they do?" Barry ?

uh...