swoosh

Same here, a buddy of mine got an invite for interview a week ago. He went to Vegas job fair. Hopefully soon

Gators

Well, that makes me feel a bit more optimistic! I forget, how long ago was the Vegas fair?

swoosh

22nd of April

sulkair

Thanks, I was not aware. Warm fuzzy returning.

Barley

I don't think you need to put much effort into thinking about it. It'll be 2018-2019 before we even have the remote chance for anything worthwhile... That's assuming this pilot group doesn't do the usual roll-over and vote yes with anything that is in front of them.

zoooropa

Rule #1. Hourly rates are completely meaningless. Hourly rates are completely meaningless. Hourly rates are completely meaningless. Hourly rates are completely meaningless.

Rule #2. Read Rule #1 until it sinks in.

Rule #3. Go back and read Rule #1 and #2

Of course we all want to be paid more, but what if a FAPA TA comes back with pay rates topping 215 and 145 (random numbers pulled out of my arse) yet all the loopholes remain?

Reassignment?
Hotels?
Schedule construction?
Reserve Assignment?
Insert 100 other problems here?

The numbers you proposed are legitimate based solely on a percentage increase over a 4 year CBA. Looking at the DAL TA, they have a proposed 21% increase for the 'bus over four years.

Your concept is right around 23%, however it is critical to understand why it was IMPERATIVE that LOA 39 and LOA 67 snapped us back to highest original book rates. If we were stuck at current rates until amendable dates the increases you contemplate would be nearly 40% vs 23%. The final snap backs really make the job of the NC more realistic.....but....

Negotiating 101. Indigo is following the playbook perfectly right now. The playbook for one year before amendable date has one line written on one page.

"F Everyone". Top of the list to bottom of the list. F them ALL!"

The reason for this is simple. Create as many problems/priorities as possible to dilute the Union's negotiating capital. We have so many different attacks on QOL right now it is amazing, and it is all by design. They are just getting started.

Eventually, the Union will put out a "Pilot Survey". All 900 pilots will put "higher hourly rates" as the #1 priority, then we will have 900 different #2 priorities.

Negotiations will start and there will be some back and forth for a couple months until the first heated debate. An expert for the company, likely from Atlanta, will wax poetic in a southern drawl about "jelly beans" and the limited number of beans in the jar. It will pretty much be downhill from there.

FAPA needs to get everyone, top to bottom, on board and ready to strike. They need to send a letter out every payday reminding people to start their own strike fund. They need to get more volunteers trained for Strike Preparedness. They need more membership meetings where actual communication takes place. A lot of work needs to be completed prior to March 2016...nine months away until early opener.

It has been said a number of times but 2015 is possibly the greatest time in the history of aviation to be in Section 6. With that being said, the FAPA NC has an incredible challenge ahead of them. We basically missed one complete cycle of CBA negotiations due to BK and the two extensions. There is absolutely zero chance this pilot group will make up enough ground without a strike.

The two possible outcomes are this;

1. Mediocre CBA passes by 60% due to fear. Keep in mind we still have a lot of pilots that "flew as captains for $50k back in the 90's". This is all gravy for them.

2. An acceptable CBA (note I didn't say good or great) passes by 70% (we will never get anything higher than 70% ratification due to the sheer number of pilots that have been totally screwed over continuously since 2008) after a Strike.

We can revisit this in four years and I will stand by my prediction. As Barley alluded, an early opener in 2016 with an actual amendable date in 2017 means status quo for at least four more years assuming we have to get released to get results. Hopefully the economic cycle doesn't change too much in the interim.

sulkair

Priceless post! Warm fuzzy obliterated

zoooropa

haha! Zoo giveth warm fuzzy...and zoo taketh away!!!!

OpenClimb

Zoo's post is spot in.

I want to reiterate he single most important point:

This group needs to be ready, willing AND ABLE to strike. We absolutely will not attain an acceptable contract without a strike. This is the way our management team operates.

PERIOD!

Start setting aside AT LEAST 10% of each paycheck right now. 10 months from now, you'll be able to do without a paycheck and not feel it. 20 months from now, you'll have 2 pay checks saved up.

If you fail to prepare, you'll be distracting our Union with your whining about financial problems when the Union should be focusing on running a strike. Be responsible starting today!

sulkair

Pretty much, LOL !

Ok, whilst I got ya Zoo..., or OpenClimb... or Anyone... When you have time, from your perspective, can you give us the down & dirty pros and cons of bringing ALPA, or not bringing ALPA over? I know it's been talked about here before, but the situation is so fluid, I'm sure thoughts of many have changed some.

I'm not advocating anything - just hoping to discuss. Unfortunately I think it's impossible to discuss in a civil manner on the internal union message board. Sometimes public is better anyway I think.