Originally Posted by Bluedriver

No Joe, he doesn't have that right. It's no different than you guys wanting to shut down my negative speech/posts. I may be more aggressive about it, but it's easier to be aggressive when you have hard data points like pay rates and retirement contribution rates to point to. You guys push back very repeatedly and regularly with your optimism that things will get better.

You all seek confirmation bias that reinforces your positive views, which basically hinge on the belief in a better future. Pretending you guys are so different is laughable. You just take the opposite side of the same coin.

Can't wait until this is all behind us.

Originally Posted by Southerner

I disagree. The only portion of your actual message that I disagree with is that it is “horrible here” and that people should avoid even applying to come here. That’s a matter of opinion for you, and it could have real negative impacts on someone if they chose to stay at a regional rather than come here. I don’t like the extreme negativity because I think it is an overreaction to the state of affairs here, but you are entitled to be that way.

The ONLY reason that I post to counter your comments on here is so that other people who aren’t pilots here can see that your voice isn’t the only voice. If those of us who disagree remain silent, your voice becomes the only one, and since those guys aren’t actually here, they think you’re actually the majority when you most definitely are not.

When I went back to the line I half expected to hear the same sentiments that you spout on here because it is true that an instructor doesn’t get a real picture of the line flying just round trips to Nassau from Orlando. But my experience has been instead that most FOs are very thoughtful about the conditions here, and agree more with Payne, myself, and JTrain. They see the areas that need improvement, and are cautiously optimistic that we will have a CBA within a year.

I flew with an FO who is from Venezuela, and his quote I thought was perfect. “The Pilots who are super negative here have lost perspective.” I agree with him. It is possible to want to fix the areas that need to be fixed, yet maintain a love of this company. You, me, Payne, and most others are truly more invested in this company than any executive. So I want us to succeed. We can’t succeed without a CBA, if for no other reason than pilot acquisition and retention.

I can say that if things don’t start change in 2018, people will likely start getting more negative. But it isn’t there yet, in my experience. I’ve only flown with a single FO who was super negative, and it was his first trip off of IOE. He had a good friend who agreed with you, and had filled the poor guy full of vitriol. Then he got wrapped up into an IROP, and rather than understand that IROPS at all Airlines are challenging (because he’s military and hasn’t seen another airline run) he immediately went hyper negative. (Because it confirmed his biases.) His buddy has done him a disservice. Attitudes are contagious, and that poor guy was miserable. It was sad to see, honestly.

Good luck man. I hope that a CBA makes you happy, though in my experience happiness comes from within.

Originally Posted by hyperboy

Or the hard data that ALPA and our MEC is working toward everything you are talking about.......Give them a chance. Go to a Rally or a family awareness event. It's a process thats all take the emotion out of it. we are one of the two players and I am looking forward to the end of the game as well.

Originally Posted by Bluedriver

You are a strange little dude. I KNOW ALPA is working on it. I've never criticised or directed frustration toward our association or our volunteers.

Originally Posted by Bluedriver

It's not horrible here, just worst among our peers. Unless your only criteria is fun in the cockpit or whatever it is you like about the "atmosphere" here.



Also, flying with E90 FOs only represents a small subset of our pilots. I've spent a lot more time on the line here than you and my experience is closer to 50/50.



I'm a VERY happy person in general. You do NOT know me or my life outside of JB. What you see is anger and disappoinment with respect to a specific entity. Nothing more. Nothing less.



The rest of the post is fine.

Originally Posted by hyperboy

a strange little dude.....hmmmm. Personal attacks.....hide behind the computer...coward comes to mind.....

rally? family awareness event?

Originally Posted by Bluedriver

You are a strange little dude because your rebuttals never make any sense. You are always answering a question that was never asked or changing the target of another person's criticism.

Like your post above, it's not ALPA who has run out of time in my book, yet you respond as though I hadn't given ALPA enough time! Even our MEC is saying that time is up!

You struggle with basic comprehension and verbal analytical skills. Strange.

I've already said I was able to make it to NYC. And I don't answer to you and YOU questioning MY support of our union shows just how strange you really are.

Originally Posted by Southerner

“Worst amongst our peers” is not true unless you think our peers are only the legacy airlines. And keep in mind that the legacies only truly pulled away in their latest negotiation cycle, so it hasn’t been that way forever.

As far as the Fleet difference goes, you’re correct. The E190 is a much different culture, which is why there isn’t much movement off the fleet. I can’t speak to the status of the bus guys.

Originally Posted by Bluedriver

I disagree that we couldn't grow faster in this environment, unless we are entirely inept (no comment).

Growth hasn't stopped YET.

I know there are no guarantees.

As for using Spirit and Frontier as peers, are they not at their end-stages of contract negotiations? Why would we include them when their contracts are horribly outdated and will be brought up to or near industry standard in the near future? I think including Spirit and Frontier is an illogical and terrible idea and hope our NC does NOT agree with you!

Spirit and Frontier compete with Delta and fly Airbuses. Did Delta accept less in their new CBA? Or did they ignore BAD DATA and charge ahead with pay rates that triggered pay raises at UAL and AA? For your reference our profit margins (the only real relevant and scalable metric) are much higher than Delta's.

Originally Posted by Bluedriver

Here it is Southerner. JTrain agreed about Spirit and Frontier. Is he wrong also, or just me as usual?