Can you show your math on this. I agree it’s not much of a raise when PTO is taken into account, but my math still shows it as a raise if you’re using all of your PTO.

 

Also, we need to consider the seniority bump that will happen with a real vacation system. That has dollars attached to it when we have to increase staffing.

 

This pilot group is so f-ing brainwashed......stop using PTO to determine your income potential. It's called paid time OFF, not paid time work harder/longer.


We should be compensated appropriately so that we can use PTO for sick days or days we just want more time off. It also allows the company to staff this airline below levels they should because so many will sell back their PTO instead of using for what it's intended for.


- Pay at the bottom of the big 6 and gap increasing each year.
- Below industry standard COLA
- 5% PS cliff
- Violation of seniority by taking away 75% of the OE trips
- No 320/321 pay difference even though the only aircraft we're getting for the life of this contract will be 321s


But hey...keep looking at the shiny penny and forget the pot of gold we could have gotten.


We had this company at it's most vulnerable position we've had them the entire 3+ years of negotiating.



- The most unified this pilot group has ever been
- Headed into summer which would have been a disaster
- Major investors downgrading the company due to labor unrest


And we let them off the hook.


This contract will pass...and pass by a wide margin because so many pilots look right in front of their noses and can't see the big picture.



Enjoy everyone. This is a "special" group of pilots....

 

All true. Unfortunately.

 

So we should or shouldn’t talk about paid time off? You contradict yourself a bit here. If you’re talking about the old PTOSB system I agree. The new system? Not really. It’s all straight time and you have to take the vacation to use some of it. It will certainly increase staffing.

 

You are my kind of troll.

 

So, a company keeps you in industry relative poverty. The denegrate your profession to be a janitor. They abuse you every day with nebulous work rules. You probably can't go anywhere else or are too old a dinosaur to go anywhere else. You are at the very bottom of the barrel and you've adjusted to it. Management has gotten you to be happy with your indentured servitude and they have succeeded in getting you to beg for table scraps and be happy with ANY carrot thrown at you. Your data for accepting this moldy sandwich is based on your being a defeated and beaten down person who can't stay in the fight. Perhaps you need to retire now.

Pathetic. Just pathetic.

You stand to lose a lot more with the current AIP proposal. The legal language will not add any new nuggets of gold. There is a much greater risk of working under a vague and ineffective contract, as alluded to by this AIP, than there is going back and renegotiating. If you don't want it to take long, pressure ALPA to picket at ANY event with lots of people often.

Let's look at "voting reality, brotha"... How many times do real pilots at real airlines vote down the crap sandwiches they get?

• https://www.fool.com/investing/gener...ntract-la.aspx
• https://www.ajc.com/business/delta-p...YnMHHafMr6T7H/

And this is what the union should be doing, but is afraid to:

• American Air's pilots vote no-confidence in CEO, executives - Chicago Tribune
• https://www.prnewswire.com/news-rele...300306888.html

I will bet you the contract final language will miss out on key contractual items. Joanna will use her legal acumen to rip you to shreds by exploiting a weak contract. I hope you like cleaning toilets. This is all by design, and you are simply a yes-man of this plan.

Management is playing you. You are being appeased with mere crumbs, just the way they planned it. Since you don't know any better, you are content with the substandard proposal.

Yes, let's wait for the final language, but stop convincing yourself that you are a loser. You can be a winner. Vote NO to a substandard contract.




This communique is for entertainment purposes only. It does not implicitly or explicitly acknowledge employment with any air carrier nor is any relationship implied. This communique does not represent the opinions or policies of ALPA or JB ALPA and does not represent the collective pilot group, ALPA, nor does it imply collective bargaining, advocacy, or workforce actions intended to disrupt operations.

 

This will pass 75/25. JB pilots are too fragmented to go to the mat. Only then will b6 expect anything close to SW rates.

 

Yeah....sorry if I was confusing. I'm talking about PTOSB. Obviously we're going to have 2 banks now.....my point is guys should stop calculating PTOSB into their income. Our pay rates should be competitive enough where we actually use the PTO for time off, not supplementing a sub-par payscale.

 

Fellas

This TA will become the CBA that we build a castle. We can’t afford waiting another 6 months of negotiations which will yield relatively nothing. We need to ink this deal and get ready for negotiations in 3years. Delta, AA and UAL will have new rates and rules and we’ll go forward from there.

If we’re on the block for a sale then we’re going to be protected. Don’t believe the nonsense that as soon as the inks dry that Jblue announces the E2. They’ve made that decision whether or not we vote YES or NO.

The details of the AIP bullets will codify our YES vote. The majority of Junior pilots benefit from this deal. Senior guys don’t too poorly. Hopefully RC and Skins won’t be getting paid vacations to S American resorts, and we can all start filling our 401k’s.

-Bubs