Are DAL/NWA pilots that upset with ALPA to actually replace them with DPA?

 

Not enough to make a difference.. alpa has no threat to it's existence on Virginia avenue.

 

There is a loud minority (but a decently sized minority; 2000 of 12000 have sent cards in) who are.

The big concerns (from what I have seen) is lack of attention to scope, communication, and sending too much $$$ to National without getting it back and subsidizing smaller carriers.

The recent LEC elections can have an impact on scope(In upcoming Sec. 6), communication (there has been a HUGE improvement in that area, with more things coming soon).

IMHO, the gorilla in the room that the DPA'ers will still see is the cash to Herndon/subsidizing issue.

I do not speak for them, nor do I agree with all of their claims, but that is essentially what I have read/seen posted.

I personally recognize the tremendous strides made by the newly elected LEC members and the MEC Chairman to improve things wherever possible, I believe improvements can be made within the existing structure, but some truly do not believe it is possible, thus the movement.

 

I have to disagree with your assessment a little. Yes, there has been an increase in the volume of one-way communication coming from DALPA to the line pilots. However, proper communication must be "two-way" and be understood and seriously considered in order to be valid. While DALPA has paid a lot of lip service to wanting pilot input, I don't see anything actually changing. We are still plodding along on essentially the same path Lee Moak put us on... getting the same results Lee Moak got. Our W-2's are at a level of buying power almost identical to what we had while the company was in bankruptcy and supposedly in danger of liquidation. In other words... no improvement to pay. A massive percentage of our domestic flying continues to be flown by non-Delta pilots. DALPA seems to go out of its way to interpret any potential scope violation in the company's favor. And DALPA refuses to make any kind of case for restoration of our profession and our careers. The silence on that one is deafening!

These are the main reasons I have given up on ALPA and do not believe it can be "fixed from within." Just too much entrenchment and resistance to change. The only hope I see for us at this point is something like DPA. Anyway, just one line pilot's opinion... and unfortunately, we can't get enough line pilots to even pay enough attention to evaluate it one way or the other. Very frustrating and not encouraging at all. Apathy kills... and it (along with a union who's objectives are completely unclear) has severely damaged the Delta pilots careers.

 

1. We are now going to be paid the NWA way, via a resolution sent up from members.
2. The P2P program is back, with well over 120 volunteers and still growing, with the express purpose of "sending up" communication and making sure it gets a response, if requested.
3. My(and other bases) new LEC reps are setting up and announcing the LEC meetings far enough in advance that I can bid to try and be there, so my voice can be heard.
4. In NYC, they have also restarted the LEC newsletter and darn near are BEGGING for input from the membership.(so are ATL and DTW, maybe others I haven't read all the LEC newletters).
5. Wilson polling is now pretty much constant, so that the MEC can know the mindset and desires of the membership.
6. The MEC put out recently that they are preparing the contract surveys for 2012, so that the membership will be able to have their say in the upcoming Section 6.
1. Previous administration, lots of turnover in the LEC.
2. How does any of this get accomplished outside of a Section 6? I'd like a plan for that, we would all get behind it if there was a legitimate and available plan of action.
"Want in one hand and (******) in the other and see which one fills up faster" comes to mind.
1. If there is a violation, it has been defended in the past and will be pursued in the future. We have a Committee dedicated to reviewing Scope on a constant basis. "Want in one hand......"
2. The last scope grievance forces the company to abide by OUR definition on numbers of active aircraft going forward? (even though the company was going to be in compliance either way within a very short time frame, now WE own the precedent and acknowledgment by the company that our definitions are to be used (not to mention how that will affect the Company's arguments in front of arbitrators in the future).

What needs to be said? All parties with a stake know that we think we are under-compensated. How much under and what will we take? Any "professional negotiator" would tell you to keep that a secret until it becomes an advantage to do so. What advantage is gained by putting out that information at the present time?

I have not given up on ALPA, even when the consensus doesn't agree with what I personally want to happen, I'm part of a team. I think that plenty of pilots, probably more than a majority really have "evaluated it one way or the other" and have decided that a new bargaining agent is not in their best interest. Apathy does kill, and it has been strangling us for a while, I'm getting involved in any way I can (and not just on APC), I'll have to do more than my part to help effect positive change for my team, because(very unfortunately) we have many who are too apathetic to play any part in restoring the profession.*


*DPA supporters are NOT apatheic in my view, but if the movement doesn't turn into a vote, I truly hope that those with the courage to submit a card will take that same energy into their LEC and the upcoming Section 6. I'm not saying anyone "must" take part in order to be legit, many people have other obligations that prevent "very active" roles in the union and that is just fine, we all have lives.

Just a for instance: What would the message to the company be if 2000 guys signed up to be part of the Strike Preparedness Committee 6 months before the Section 6 opened? Mad and full of energy is just what the SPC will need in about a year. IMHO, that would send a very strong message to the company.

 

Very interesting...

ATL Surge Week Report

 

Interesting reading. I have not sent in a card but the actions by management and alpa are very similar to the three union drives I witnessed at my old carrier. It sucks when adults act like children, no matter what side of the drive they are on.

On another note, I sent a message regarding RAH to my reps via the dalpa website a week ago. I requested a response to my email. How long will it take to get a response?

 

That is a VERY interesting op-ed. Especially the part about John Malone being a big supporter of the DPA......The guy who was in charge of the union when it sent a TA to the pilot group that had huge raises and completely sold out the bottom half of the pilot group on small jet scope relaxation. Awesome.

Rhetorical question: Why would a guy who got bounced hard from his position in the MEC be supportive of a group that is antagonistic of the organization that removed him from his position?

I'm actually surprised that DPA was allowed at all on company property. ALPA is the "duly designated and authorized representative of the Flight Deck Crewmembers in the service of the Company for the purposes of the Railway Labor Act"; for them to allow a competing bargaining agent into a work area is dangerously close to a violation of the RLA.

I wonder if I could file a grievance against the company for a violation of the very first paragraph of the PWA, Section 1.A.1....

 

Heyas,

My guess is that unless you were there personally to witness what went on, you will never know what really happened.

Nu

 

Thanks for that link DAL 88.

Absolutely revolting behavior on the part of ALPA reps on full flight pay loss. This is so shameful.

ALPA must really be concerned to put forth this kind of effort to limit free speech and free association. I wonder how ALPA feels about limiting two of the most important rights we have under the constitution.

Carl