Delta Pilots Association
10-05-2010, 12:47 PM
#771
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Joined APC: Dec 2007
Position: No to large RJs
Posts: 369
Originally Posted by tsquare
Except that this is America. Wh haven't thrown anybody out since 1776. The political machines no matter how local or how national, are powerful, and Americans in general are too afraid to exact a change in the known quantity. No.. the DPA will not survive just like the PPA before them, because the ALPA national machine is way too strong. But hopefully it will awaken some of those that have no idea of how badly we wasting our money that they will demand reformation. Well.. I can dream can't I?
10-05-2010, 01:30 PM
#772
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Joined APC: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,462
Originally Posted by DAWGS
Actually the independent unions made out best, imho.
10-05-2010, 01:32 PM
#773
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Joined APC: Aug 2007
Position: non acceptus excretus
Posts: 561
Originally Posted by Pineapple Guy
Care to give an example? And please don't point to SWA or UPS, as the union had nothing to do with relative values of those contracts. They have both been extremely profitable over the years, yet their pay has always lagged the industry.... until everyone that mattered went bankrupt.
10-05-2010, 01:53 PM
#774
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Joined APC: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,619
Originally Posted by Pineapple Guy
Care to give an example? And please don't point to SWA or UPS, as the union had nothing to do with relative values of those contracts. They have both been extremely profitable over the years, yet their pay has always lagged the industry.... until everyone that mattered went bankrupt.
10-05-2010, 02:43 PM
#775
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Thread Starter
Joined APC: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,503
Originally Posted by alfaromeo
...and of course you forget USAPA. Since they threw ALPA out things have been absolutely rosy around there. Multiple lawsuits, injunctions, massive legal bills, no contract advancement. Please let's be like them.
The one that ultimately might result in the removal of DALPA and ALPA.
1. The massive overindulgence and tone deaf out of control spending of dues $$$ coupled with the lack of fiscal responsibilty.
2. The lack of representation of the will of the "customers" (line pilots) at the MEC and National level.
3. Conflict of interests with the other ALPA member groups.
4. Finally, the arrogant and cavalier attitude of the DALPA MEC and their utter lack of communication and accountability.
Alpha. Lets get back to that apple/orange thing. USAPA was born out the blatant seniority grab done by the US Airways east pilots otherwise known as the "Angry F/O Club."
By forming USAPA and tossing ALPA, they hoped to disallow or ignore the Nicolau Award. That involves litagation. Can't promise anything as you are concerned with law suits. However, I only see possible litagation from the disgruntled folks that will cling to with ALPA with their last finger nail for what ever their personal motivations are.
Me. I don't see anything wrong with sending a card in and forcing the issue. Either DALPA/ALPA listens and changes.....quickly and with conviction, or, DPA will be given a chance to present their plan and a vote will be taken.
Actually...after mulling this over for the better part of two weeks, I put a Forever stamp on my envelope and gave it to the nice lady at the post office today.
10-05-2010, 03:19 PM
#776
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2007
Position: No to large RJs
Posts: 369
Originally Posted by Pineapple Guy
Care to give an example? And please don't point to SWA or UPS, as the union had nothing to do with relative values of those contracts. They have both been extremely profitable over the years, yet their pay has always lagged the industry.... until everyone that mattered went bankrupt.
10-05-2010, 04:41 PM
#777
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Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: 747-400 Captain
Posts: 12,487
Originally Posted by Sink r8
Come on, Carl... "there will be no power grab"? And we will get a little pixie dust sprinkled on us, and just fly home from these DPA meetings?
Originally Posted by Sink r8
This particular group has only been good for a few vague promises, but the main thrust of their argument is that things have really, really sucked (no kidding), and Prater is a boob (no kidding) so... DPA.
Originally Posted by Sink r8
When you say there will be "just elections", I suspect you have an idea whose election you mean. Because I sure can't believe you'd be naive enough to be promting the removal of ALPA at DAL, without knowing wh you'd turn the keys over to.
Carl
10-05-2010, 04:57 PM
#778
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Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: 747-400 Captain
Posts: 12,487
Originally Posted by Sink r8
Right now, when I ask, I'm told this group is the same group that tried the 44 recalls. In other words, it's the previous administration, trying to come back. It's the tie-up of the discarded products from the South and the North, driven by bitterness. I don't know if this is true, which is why I find it so important to hear who DPA really is.
Originally Posted by Sink r8
My fear is that we line pilots will get caugh in the middle. If the people that are obsessed with power would be content to simply be called "Mr. Chairman", and walk around in five-striped uniforms, saluting each other, it would be no problem.
Originally Posted by Sink r8
I'm all for trading all this in for a new Product C12. New and improved. For that reason, I'm all for reforms, and not at all for old leaders to come back from the grave, or for power struggles disguised as something else.
Carl
10-05-2010, 05:00 PM
#779
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Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: 747-400 Captain
Posts: 12,487
Originally Posted by Superdad
First let me say that in my opinion ALPA cannot be changed from within. I truly believe that a clean slate is needed. That aside, I am not enamored with DPA's approach. So far they have no stated goals other than getting rid of ALPA. I think the timing is poor and I don't think that they are being very realistic about getting people out to vote since few pilots vote in elections for ALPA reps. In addition there is one little statement on their website that bothers me, perhaps I am being to sensitive but this just seems silly:
"The president will be anelected active Delta captain and the vice president will be an elected active Delta first officer."
Why must the president be a captain, shouldn't we elect the best person for the job regardless of what seat they are in? How is a Captain better suited to be president than an FO? There are plenty of FO's who are more than senior enough to hold Captain but choose to be FO's why does their seat choice matter when it comes to representing the pilots? I think it is just stupid and frankly childish.
Not too impressed, DPA.
"The president will be anelected active Delta captain and the vice president will be an elected active Delta first officer."
Why must the president be a captain, shouldn't we elect the best person for the job regardless of what seat they are in? How is a Captain better suited to be president than an FO? There are plenty of FO's who are more than senior enough to hold Captain but choose to be FO's why does their seat choice matter when it comes to representing the pilots? I think it is just stupid and frankly childish.
Not too impressed, DPA.
Carl
10-05-2010, 05:03 PM
#780
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Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: 747-400 Captain
Posts: 12,487
Originally Posted by Sink r8
So the logic is that ALPA National officers had a "huge party" at the Diplomat, and the inescapable conclusion is that we must slit our own wrists at DALPA by switching to DPA?
Carl
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