Competitive time
02-19-2019, 05:23 AM
#11
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2019
Posts: 310
Originally Posted by P8Driver
There are a few flying billets, but I don't think I'd add more than a few hundred hours by getting one. Not to mention everybody is trying to get the few slots available. I'm not sure yet if I'll be able to get out from there, but it's not looking like it.
Extend at 30 until within 12 months of your MSR and resign if possible.
If not, Dallas or the U would be ideal.
If not, any flying orders.
If not, a CVN in RCOH where you can show up with your resignation in hand and go on terminal leave 9 months later.
If not, a CVN with that is in the yards/ just came back from deployment... once again resignation orders in hand.
Hours wise, you’re in the ballpark. I have a buddy who a couple years ago left off his shore tour from VP-30 with 1700hrs (2000 with the conversion ans just over 1000hrs PIC/IP time) got an interview at Delta and ended up at FedEx.
You’re in the ballpark hours wise. If you’ve got to go to the boat and don’t want to move after look at a Norfolk CVN so you can go to PSA asap on terminal leave if a major doesn’t call by then.
02-19-2019, 11:45 AM
#12
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2017
Posts: 197
I think too many of us place too much emphasis on hours; that being said who knows what any HR department is exactly looking for. My point is... a decade of flight experience is a decade of flight experience. Hours are an indicator of experience on a resume but they don't tell the entire story. I suspect that hours tell a whole lot more about an individual coming out of the 121 world than they do about military experience. Flight time is such a variable in the military depending on timing and location. Much of the learning in the military about flying is done without logging flight time.
02-19-2019, 07:34 PM
#13
Line Holder
Joined APC: Oct 2018
Posts: 46
Originally Posted by BrownDoubles
Flight time is such a variable in the military depending on timing and location. Much of the learning in the military about flying is done without logging flight time.
I agree, and I feel like the answer to your question has some important missing variables.
1000 hrs PIC is definitely a discriminator.
2000, maybe 2500 hours will get you a phone call most places IF:
- you have EP time
- you have IP time
- you have an advanced degree
- you have safety stink or some extra aviation-related experience
- you have something extraordinary on your resume, like hosting refugee families in your home or running a big brothers/big sisters program
- you have lots of good internal recs
- your app is spotless
Doesn’t hurt if your buds drop your resume on their chief pilot’s desk maybe too (or equivalent, depending on the company)
$.02
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02-19-2019, 09:01 PM
#14
Prime Minister/Moderator
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Position: Engines Turn Or People Swim
Posts: 36,359
Originally Posted by FlyingHercs
Good luck finding any current, non 20+ year, Navy or Marine Corps big Wing (P-8 or C-130) guy with 4-5k hours. 1600-2200 hrs is about all one could expect if getting out in the 8-12 years of service range. Can’t say I know anyone in the 07’-12’ peer group with much over 2000 hrs.
It’s not the Air Force. Hours aren’t as easy to come by. Guys leaving after a first tour are at around 1300 TT with 500 PIC. Then you have to go to the RAG, flight school (T-6, C-12, or T-44 so slightly less valuable), or manage a second tour to get the rest of those hours. Trying to break 1k PIC in the P-8/C-130 world is a real challenge these days (guys coming in post heavy Iraq and Afghanistan flying) for anyone looking to get out at the end of their original contract.
Maybe the regionals are in all our future...or it’s a good ploy by the Navy/Marine Corps to make us stay longer to get more hours. I don’t know about you, but I’ll take my chances on the outside.
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It’s not the Air Force. Hours aren’t as easy to come by. Guys leaving after a first tour are at around 1300 TT with 500 PIC. Then you have to go to the RAG, flight school (T-6, C-12, or T-44 so slightly less valuable), or manage a second tour to get the rest of those hours. Trying to break 1k PIC in the P-8/C-130 world is a real challenge these days (guys coming in post heavy Iraq and Afghanistan flying) for anyone looking to get out at the end of their original contract.
Maybe the regionals are in all our future...or it’s a good ploy by the Navy/Marine Corps to make us stay longer to get more hours. I don’t know about you, but I’ll take my chances on the outside.
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I was talking about what hours would get you hired, not how much you could get in ten years in the military. Those numbers used to be the same but not necessarily any more... the trend is now set that you go to the regionals if you're a bit short on hours or resume bullets.
I was also talking about typical numbers, not the exceptions. I don't know what MPRA guys are getting hired with, haven't seen one in the reserves in a long while.
Concur that the whole package is considered, not just hours.
02-21-2019, 10:00 AM
#15
On Reserve
Joined APC: Jun 2016
Position: P-8A Instructor
Posts: 14
Originally Posted by Phoenix21
In order:
Extend at 30 until within 12 months of your MSR and resign if possible.
Extend at 30 until within 12 months of your MSR and resign if possible.
Originally Posted by Phoenix21
If not, Dallas or the U would be ideal.
Having seen some P-3/P-8 FRS guys get hired at DAL and American with right around 1700 HRS FAA style, would you rather do your 10 months on a boat, get out at MSR, and hope you get hired by a major with lighter numbers and then fall back on a regional if you don't... Or take 2 year flying orders (Dallas, U, PEP), give up a potential year or seniority, but leave the Navy current with higher hours?
02-21-2019, 12:16 PM
#16
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2019
Posts: 310
Originally Posted by P8Bubba
PERS got wise of this and unfortunately isn't an option for anyone except for the lucky few who got orders cut less than 12 months out from MSR.
Dallas now makes you serve the full 24 month orders instead of being able to get out at your MSR. (Most people enjoy the job so not a big deal) Question for anyone here that I have is:
Having seen some P-3/P-8 FRS guys get hired at DAL and American with right around 1700 HRS FAA style, would you rather do your 10 months on a boat, get out at MSR, and hope you get hired by a major with lighter numbers and then fall back on a regional if you don't... Or take 2 year flying orders (Dallas, U, PEP), give up a potential year or seniority, but leave the Navy current with higher hours?
Dallas now makes you serve the full 24 month orders instead of being able to get out at your MSR. (Most people enjoy the job so not a big deal) Question for anyone here that I have is:
Having seen some P-3/P-8 FRS guys get hired at DAL and American with right around 1700 HRS FAA style, would you rather do your 10 months on a boat, get out at MSR, and hope you get hired by a major with lighter numbers and then fall back on a regional if you don't... Or take 2 year flying orders (Dallas, U, PEP), give up a potential year or seniority, but leave the Navy current with higher hours?
02-21-2019, 06:20 PM
#17
Line Holder
Joined APC: May 2013
Posts: 63
Originally Posted by FlyingHercs
Good luck finding any current, non 20+ year, Navy or Marine Corps big Wing (P-8 or C-130) guy with 4-5k hours. 1600-2200 hrs is about all one could expect if getting out in the 8-12 years of service range. Can’t say I know anyone in the 07’-12’ peer group with much over 2000 hrs.
It’s not the Air Force. Hours aren’t as easy to come by. Guys leaving after a first tour are at around 1300 TT with 500 PIC. Then you have to go to the RAG, flight school (T-6, C-12, or T-44 so slightly less valuable), or manage a second tour to get the rest of those hours. Trying to break 1k PIC in the P-8/C-130 world is a real challenge these days (guys coming in post heavy Iraq and Afghanistan flying) for anyone looking to get out at the end of their original contract.
Maybe the regionals are in all our future...or it’s a good ploy by the Navy/Marine Corps to make us stay longer to get more hours. I don’t know about you, but I’ll take my chances on the outside.
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It’s not the Air Force. Hours aren’t as easy to come by. Guys leaving after a first tour are at around 1300 TT with 500 PIC. Then you have to go to the RAG, flight school (T-6, C-12, or T-44 so slightly less valuable), or manage a second tour to get the rest of those hours. Trying to break 1k PIC in the P-8/C-130 world is a real challenge these days (guys coming in post heavy Iraq and Afghanistan flying) for anyone looking to get out at the end of their original contract.
Maybe the regionals are in all our future...or it’s a good ploy by the Navy/Marine Corps to make us stay longer to get more hours. I don’t know about you, but I’ll take my chances on the outside.
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Dudes punching after their 10 year commitments have done well if they have 3k hours (heavy) or 1500 hours (fighter).
I’m a heavy guy flying trainers currently and I’ll be lucky to have 3k total/1500 PIC at my commitment...
02-22-2019, 02:35 AM
#18
Line Holder
Joined APC: Jan 2017
Posts: 42
Originally Posted by Wheelsoff
I’m a heavy guy flying trainers currently and I’ll be lucky to have 3k total/1500 PIC at my commitment...
Definitely a different world than even a few years ago. War sucks, but it made for some heavy logbooks for quite a few years.
As a C-130 guy who has always been in a flying job, I’ll be lucky to break 1900 TT and 800 PIC when I leave after an 8 year contract. These numbers are typical of the majority of my peers as well.
I hope everyone else is right that additional quals, being an IP/EP, advanced degrees, etc is more important than the number in the logbook that I have zero control over.
Good luck and fingers crossed to all
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02-22-2019, 03:59 AM
#19
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2014
Posts: 127
The problem with minimums for a Major is that it is not a person who initially screens the application. It is a computer. Either you have 1000 hours PIC or you don’t. If you’re target airline uses AirlineApps the minimum are a hard requirement.
Determine if the airline you want to fly for accepts the sortie add for military. Do the math and use those numbers.
I personally had 4000 hours total, 2000 FW, 1100 FW PIC and 1300 RW PIC/ IP. Heavy safety background and a BA. I had several of my Army peers with less get picked up at United and American. Air Force/Navy guys typically are picked up if they meet company minimums and have their app in order. Hope that helps.
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Determine if the airline you want to fly for accepts the sortie add for military. Do the math and use those numbers.
I personally had 4000 hours total, 2000 FW, 1100 FW PIC and 1300 RW PIC/ IP. Heavy safety background and a BA. I had several of my Army peers with less get picked up at United and American. Air Force/Navy guys typically are picked up if they meet company minimums and have their app in order. Hope that helps.
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02-22-2019, 04:46 AM
#20
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2009
Position: A320 FO
Posts: 281
Originally Posted by FlyingHercs
I hope everyone else is right that additional quals, being an IP/EP, advanced degrees, etc is more important than the number in the logbook that I have zero control over.
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