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NetJets Tentative Agreement - thoughts?

Old 03-21-2024, 08:09 AM
  #41  
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Originally Posted by MinRest
You aren't hired as a 14 year CA at NetJets either, yet that was the basis of measurement.
Unless he edited the post after your reply, he said that in the same post. You don't need the last word when someone is already agreeing with you.
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Old 03-21-2024, 12:04 PM
  #42  
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Originally Posted by jtf560
Unless he edited the post after your reply, he said that in the same post. You don't need the last word when someone is already agreeing with you.
I am merely pointing out the adjusting of the pay gap because airlines pay for health insurance, can go both ways.
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Old 03-21-2024, 03:40 PM
  #43  
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Originally Posted by MinRest
I am merely pointing out the adjusting of the pay gap because airlines pay for health insurance, can go both ways.
The insurance can definitely go both ways, so you should have argued that instead of going back to the apples to oranges years of service that the union used to conflate the number. He already hammered that along side you. I agree it is a misleading comparison used in the TA primer. Most of us see the comparisons in the primer as very suspect and manipulated statistics.

Those who are debating about whether or not to sign up for an interesting career that will include a whole lot of flogging need to understand the numbers and how they will pertain to the remainder of their career. The primer doesn't really show that unless you spend the time to analyze the actual numbers for each year of service. The actual numbers show that even though the very top of the scales and the very bottom of the scales were able to keep within sight distance of pay at at the majors (not including retirement), those middle 12 years are a whole lot of career left in the dust. The pay scales at NetJets go up very evenly from year one to 14 while the airlines crank up the FO pay greatly for a few years before evening out to a slow climb and they start the PIC scales quite high at year one and they don't get so wildly different by the top. The monetary difference over a career is just massive, not even including the staggering difference in retirement contributions from the employers. The pay scales are simply light years behind over a career.
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Old 03-21-2024, 05:09 PM
  #44  
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When the new TA came out, I did a VERY detailed financial comparison for myself (39 years old, year 3 Phenom PIC). I accounted for variables such as profit sharing, health insurance, DC, etc.

I used my current position at NJ as a PIC with 25.5 years left until age 65 compared to a move to a Major that has a hub where I live. I assumed not upgrading until year 8 at said Major since the current most junior Captain is a year 8 guy and I don’t want to commute to a junior base just to have a fourth stripe.

Interestingly, with choosing to wait to upgrade, the break even point on annual income is actually 16 years if I make the move. From that 16 years to retirement however, my salary would be far greater by making a move. On the order of $900,000 over 25.5 years.

The retirement account is where the real difference is seen. Going to a Major airline now means a difference of $5 million in my 401K.

So, while the new TA would offer a respectable income and retirement, it will earn me about $6 million less than a move to a Major airline. This is all while working on average 72 less days a year AND not working 12-14 hour duty days for 7 days straight.

Obviously, the difference for someone even a few years younger would be exponentially greater. We’re talking multiple millions more.
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Old 03-21-2024, 05:41 PM
  #45  
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Originally Posted by yankeepilot42
When the new TA came out, I did a VERY detailed financial comparison for myself (39 years old, year 3 Phenom PIC). I accounted for variables such as profit sharing, health insurance, DC, etc.

I used my current position at NJ as a PIC with 25.5 years left until age 65 compared to a move to a Major that has a hub where I live. I assumed not upgrading until year 8 at said Major since the current most junior Captain is a year 8 guy and I don’t want to commute to a junior base just to have a fourth stripe.

Interestingly, with choosing to wait to upgrade, the break even point on annual income is actually 16 years if I make the move. From that 16 years to retirement however, my salary would be far greater by making a move. On the order of $900,000 over 25.5 years.

The retirement account is where the real difference is seen. Going to a Major airline now means a difference of $5 million in my 401K.

So, while the new TA would offer a respectable income and retirement, it will earn me about $6 million less than a move to a Major airline. This is all while working on average 72 less days a year AND not working 12-14 hour duty days for 7 days straight.

Obviously, the difference for someone even a few years younger would be exponentially greater. We’re talking multiple millions more.

I stopped reading when you said you lived in base at a legacy airline 😂. IMO, that’s a simple choice.

For those living in middle of nowhere, a few years older, a few kids, a 2 leg commute etc….. might not be worth it of course.
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Old 03-22-2024, 03:08 PM
  #46  
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Originally Posted by yankeepilot42
When the new TA came out, I did a VERY detailed financial comparison for myself (39 years old, year 3 Phenom PIC). I accounted for variables such as profit sharing, health insurance, DC, etc.

I used my current position at NJ as a PIC with 25.5 years left until age 65 compared to a move to a Major that has a hub where I live. I assumed not upgrading until year 8 at said Major since the current most junior Captain is a year 8 guy and I don’t want to commute to a junior base just to have a fourth stripe.

Interestingly, with choosing to wait to upgrade, the break even point on annual income is actually 16 years if I make the move. From that 16 years to retirement however, my salary would be far greater by making a move. On the order of $900,000 over 25.5 years.

The retirement account is where the real difference is seen. Going to a Major airline now means a difference of $5 million in my 401K.

So, while the new TA would offer a respectable income and retirement, it will earn me about $6 million less than a move to a Major airline. This is all while working on average 72 less days a year AND not working 12-14 hour duty days for 7 days straight.

Obviously, the difference for someone even a few years younger would be exponentially greater. We’re talking multiple millions more.
So are you leaving?
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Old 03-22-2024, 03:53 PM
  #47  
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Interview next week, and if I am lucky enough to get the offer, absolutely! The money isn’t even the primary motivator. Just got back from a tour, two fatigues, and I still feel like I was pushed through a meat grinder; unfortunately that will never change at NJ.
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Old 03-22-2024, 03:56 PM
  #48  
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Originally Posted by yankeepilot42
Interview next week, and if I am lucky enough to get the offer, absolutely! The money isn’t even the primary motivator. Just got back from a tour, two fatigues, and I still feel like I was pushed through a meat grinder; unfortunately that will never change at NJ.
See you later. All of EWR 787 FO's are going on reserve for the summer.

What does that tell you?
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Old 03-22-2024, 05:56 PM
  #49  
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Originally Posted by yankeepilot42
I assumed not upgrading until year 8 at said Major since the current most junior Captain is a year 8 guy and I don’t want to commute to a junior base just to have a fourth stripe.
Who's hiring that has an 8 year upgrade?
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Old 03-22-2024, 07:51 PM
  #50  
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Originally Posted by Swedepilut
See you later. All of EWR 787 FO's are going on reserve for the summer.

What does that tell you?
It means 73 hrs pay/month to play golf?
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