Penair News
01-30-2009, 10:13 AM
#141
Line Holder
Joined APC: Sep 2008
Posts: 25
Originally Posted by penairpilot
I wish......management just fired them, no furloughs. Management knows how this works, after the firings they put an at will employment form in everyones box they had to sign. This is the reason we need a union. But as stated, people don't have the guts to do anything.
The Saab 2000's. No, PenAir is having problems securing the financing for the planes. People seem to think that Saab is going to help us do everything, such as certification and parts support. Saab is there to make money, thats what a company does. Nothing is free!!! Why did they support the 340 so well? Because the planes were five years old, they were pretty much brand new. Now that some are almost 15 years old, I think the tone will change. We should invest in aircraft built in the last decade.
Another issue with the 2000 is the ice speeds. Now with most aircraft that are 121, you add a buffer to your ref speed if you have any ice on the aircraft at all. With the metro it's 19 knots, even if you have trace ice. Do we every add this......no. The issue is that this increases your landing distance. When landing in Dutch this becomes a problem. At max 0 fuel weight and fuel for CDB with reserves the factored landing distance in dutch for the 2000 is 4300' when you use ice approach speeds. Demonstrated landing distance is the actual distance it takes to stop an aircraft, 2580' in this case. Factored landing distance is demonstrated + 40%. 121 requires us to use factored for performance. This is one fact that management has kept from us. Why do you think Harding is in town, Honty lates cant figure this one out for himself. It will be fun to watch this play out during the proving runs.
The 2000 is not that great really, meairlinepilot. We know your douchebag management, so stop trying to spread your propaganda BS. Most of us think that PenAir sucks, so stop trying to increase moral.
On my knees to service my fellow pilots forever.......TT
The Saab 2000's. No, PenAir is having problems securing the financing for the planes. People seem to think that Saab is going to help us do everything, such as certification and parts support. Saab is there to make money, thats what a company does. Nothing is free!!! Why did they support the 340 so well? Because the planes were five years old, they were pretty much brand new. Now that some are almost 15 years old, I think the tone will change. We should invest in aircraft built in the last decade.
Another issue with the 2000 is the ice speeds. Now with most aircraft that are 121, you add a buffer to your ref speed if you have any ice on the aircraft at all. With the metro it's 19 knots, even if you have trace ice. Do we every add this......no. The issue is that this increases your landing distance. When landing in Dutch this becomes a problem. At max 0 fuel weight and fuel for CDB with reserves the factored landing distance in dutch for the 2000 is 4300' when you use ice approach speeds. Demonstrated landing distance is the actual distance it takes to stop an aircraft, 2580' in this case. Factored landing distance is demonstrated + 40%. 121 requires us to use factored for performance. This is one fact that management has kept from us. Why do you think Harding is in town, Honty lates cant figure this one out for himself. It will be fun to watch this play out during the proving runs.
The 2000 is not that great really, meairlinepilot. We know your douchebag management, so stop trying to spread your propaganda BS. Most of us think that PenAir sucks, so stop trying to increase moral.
On my knees to service my fellow pilots forever.......TT
01-30-2009, 11:07 AM
#142
Line Holder
Joined APC: Jul 2007
Position: Left
Posts: 71
"The Saab 2000's. No, PenAir is having problems securing the financing for the planes. People seem to think that Saab is going to help us do everything, such as certification and parts support. Saab is there to make money, thats what a company does."
I don't think Saab was selling these airplanes to us. That was under an old deal where they were supposed to pay for certification. I'm pretty sure they're dealing with Ginn Racing directly.
I don't think Saab was selling these airplanes to us. That was under an old deal where they were supposed to pay for certification. I'm pretty sure they're dealing with Ginn Racing directly.
01-30-2009, 11:07 AM
#143
On Reserve
Joined APC: Nov 2008
Posts: 19
Originally Posted by meairlinepilot
...especially with the few PenAir bashers from Era on here. I haven't heard from them recently since our news of the possibility of the 2000's...
Penair bashers are Penair pilots who are disgruntled and unhappy with their jobs. We don't like where we work or for whom we work.
If you are not management then you must have a Penair koolaid i.v. going. You seem completely blind about the company for which you work.
Well, maybe you are just worried that the second floor is watching and you don't want to be a member of the third round of lay-offs. Oh yeah, the third round is only a short time away.
By the way, are we really in such a desperate situation that Penair is asking us to take unpaid leave? Does that really save any money? Ten pilots taking a week off might save ten grand. How bout we try cancelling a few trips when the weather is questionable? One missed in SNP with the Saab probably costs five grand. What's the phrase, dropping dollars to pick up pennies? Or maybe we could get rid of ramp middle management? Or maybe Al? Or maybe one of the countless Penair employees that does nothing all day?
01-30-2009, 11:20 AM
#144
Line Holder
Joined APC: Sep 2008
Posts: 25
Originally Posted by ks4life
Do you really think the Penair bashers are Era pilots? Surely, you can't be that dense. You don't think that Era really gives a ****** about us. I don't care about them so why would they worry about us. They have jobs, mortgages, and families. I don't think any of them are lame enough to waste their day on a forum thread for an airline that does not employ them. Are you wasting your time on Era threads? Come on, pull your head out!
Penair bashers are Penair pilots who are disgruntled and unhappy with their jobs. We don't like where we work or for whom we work.
Penair bashers are Penair pilots who are disgruntled and unhappy with their jobs. We don't like where we work or for whom we work.
You misunderstood me. I didn't say anything about the PenAir bashers from Era being the people posting on this thread. I've read a couple of posts in a few other threads that were derrogatory about PenAir. Again, nothing to do with the conversations in the posts on this thread. I doubt that anyone from Era is on this thread really
01-30-2009, 03:18 PM
#145
Line Holder
Joined APC: Aug 2008
Posts: 35
Look, this is all a goat show. I am not bashing PenAir. I'm just stating the truth.....Facts. First of all Era is doing fine, they did not fire a bunch of people out of order. If they were talking smack about that, it was only the truth.
I'm feel sorry that you think you fly for a legit company. As always you don't know the way the world works. Yes the 2000's will be coming from some racing company. It's the support that will cost. Look at the metros, the people that have our old ones used them for parts. Its only a matter of time before the Saabs end up the same way. Do you really want to work at PenAir forever? If so you should seriously consider the fact that we are investing in a product that was both unsuccessful in production numbers(Saab only built 50 2000's) and now aged.
On my knees to service my fellow pilots forever........Ty
I'm feel sorry that you think you fly for a legit company. As always you don't know the way the world works. Yes the 2000's will be coming from some racing company. It's the support that will cost. Look at the metros, the people that have our old ones used them for parts. Its only a matter of time before the Saabs end up the same way. Do you really want to work at PenAir forever? If so you should seriously consider the fact that we are investing in a product that was both unsuccessful in production numbers(Saab only built 50 2000's) and now aged.
On my knees to service my fellow pilots forever........Ty
01-30-2009, 04:18 PM
#146
Line Holder
Joined APC: Dec 2005
Posts: 76
Originally Posted by meairlinepilot
Of course it's just a rumor. Silly kids, you should know that by now. Absolutely nothing has been said either way definitively yet. I know there are several PenAir pilots on here. What is everyone's feelings about bringing the 2000's onboard? I'm really excited about the possibility of getting to fly one one of these days. Have you guys/gals looked into them and their specs.? Heck of a turboprop in my opinion, compared to the 340. Gorgeous plane!
This is why we will never have a union. To easily distracted by shiny things to see the shat rising around us. Forget the 2000. Forget the overpayed "management". Forget the stupid things we do that lose money.
Just think about this:
Just about everyone who was fired, was informed that there would be a new ground school they could re-apply for. (awesome) This ground school was being held because they needed a few good Caravan FO's. The best thing about this job is that you get payed about 500 bucks a week and are basically a glorified ramper. So you won't have much food, but will be stacking freight 14hours a day! Just think of it as a weight loss program! As an experienced bush driver and metro captain, this job should be cake!
Might as well shat in their wheaties and say you did them a favor by adding raisins.
This is the type of management you are dealing with here.
Please God let the airline industry improve so that those of us with real brains and ambition (and no DUI or criminal record) can leave for somewhere else.
01-30-2009, 10:54 PM
#147
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2008
Position: Cessna 205
Posts: 227
Originally Posted by ks4life
Do you really think the Penair bashers are Era pilots? Surely, you can't be that dense. You don't think that Era really gives a ****** about us. I don't care about them so why would they worry about us. They have jobs, mortgages, and families. I don't think any of them are lame enough to waste their day on a forum thread for an airline that does not employ them. Are you wasting your time on Era threads? Come on, pull your head out!
Penair bashers are Penair pilots who are disgruntled and unhappy with their jobs. We don't like where we work or for whom we work.
If you are not management then you must have a Penair koolaid i.v. going. You seem completely blind about the company for which you work.
Well, maybe you are just worried that the second floor is watching and you don't want to be a member of the third round of lay-offs. Oh yeah, the third round is only a short time away.
By the way, are we really in such a desperate situation that Penair is asking us to take unpaid leave? Does that really save any money? Ten pilots taking a week off might save ten grand. How bout we try cancelling a few trips when the weather is questionable? One missed in SNP with the Saab probably costs five grand. What's the phrase, dropping dollars to pick up pennies? Or maybe we could get rid of ramp middle management? Or maybe Al? Or maybe one of the countless Penair employees that does nothing all day?
Penair bashers are Penair pilots who are disgruntled and unhappy with their jobs. We don't like where we work or for whom we work.
If you are not management then you must have a Penair koolaid i.v. going. You seem completely blind about the company for which you work.
Well, maybe you are just worried that the second floor is watching and you don't want to be a member of the third round of lay-offs. Oh yeah, the third round is only a short time away.
By the way, are we really in such a desperate situation that Penair is asking us to take unpaid leave? Does that really save any money? Ten pilots taking a week off might save ten grand. How bout we try cancelling a few trips when the weather is questionable? One missed in SNP with the Saab probably costs five grand. What's the phrase, dropping dollars to pick up pennies? Or maybe we could get rid of ramp middle management? Or maybe Al? Or maybe one of the countless Penair employees that does nothing all day?
02-01-2009, 07:55 AM
#148
Line Holder
Joined APC: Sep 2008
Posts: 25
Originally Posted by penairpilot
Look, this is all a goat show. I am not bashing PenAir. I'm just stating the truth.....Facts.
I'm feel sorry that you think you fly for a legit company. As always you don't know the way the world works.
On my knees to service my fellow pilots forever........Ty
I'm feel sorry that you think you fly for a legit company. As always you don't know the way the world works.
On my knees to service my fellow pilots forever........Ty
And I'm sorry too that you can't just make the most of difficult times and you'd rather spend your time on here b*tching about PenAir. I don't know about you, but I'm thankful I fly for PenAir right about now. Not to mention I am thankful I have a flying job whatsoever. Tens of thousands don't and would do anything to be in our shoes. Have a nice day of flying
02-01-2009, 08:06 AM
#149
Line Holder
Joined APC: Mar 2006
Position: Pilot & A & P
Posts: 60
I fly for the "other carrier" across the way. I know a few of your pilots and they are great people. I also know one that got let go in that last round of "furloughs". I would not wish that on any person. I hope no one else gets the same treatment, especially in this job market as I am sure like us most of you have families and mortgages.
I send you my best wishes for a better future in these hard times. We went through a rough patch a couple years ago and seem to have come out OK. Some at Penair cheered hoping for our demise. I cannot and will not do that to you. We are all in this industry together. Good Luck to you all.
I send you my best wishes for a better future in these hard times. We went through a rough patch a couple years ago and seem to have come out OK. Some at Penair cheered hoping for our demise. I cannot and will not do that to you. We are all in this industry together. Good Luck to you all.
Last edited by r1830; 02-01-2009 at 10:03 AM. Reason: Spelling
02-01-2009, 09:41 AM
#150
Line Holder
Joined APC: Jul 2007
Position: Left
Posts: 71
Originally Posted by meairlinepilot
And I'm sorry too that you can't just make the most of difficult times and you'd rather spend your time on here b*tching about PenAir. I don't know about you, but I'm thankful I fly for PenAir right about now. Not to mention I am thankful I have a flying job whatsoever. Tens of thousands don't and would do anything to be in our shoes. Have a nice day of flying
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