I can only speak for myself. I know what the FAA defines as PIC under 61. I however became a pilot as a carrier, that being said I began logging time under the most conservative interpritation of all of the definitions having been described to me as what a PIC is (when I am assigned by a company to act as PIC of an aircraft) I realize that this is just my standard for myself, but every interview I have every done was made very easy by only logging PIC in this manor. When the question gets asked about PIC time I could answer with confidence that I was asssigned the PIC by a company I was flying for. (it also makes filling out applications real easy as well) I let the lawyers figure out all the legal jargin, I just fly airplanes.

 

I too am confused between the FARs and what actually occurs in reality. In my company many of the pilots have operated the King Air 200 single piloted for years. But when they fly with certain customers on board, the contract dictates two pilots. Some have said both qualified captains log PIC. I am not too comfortable with that myself. Therefore, I chose to log PIC when the company assigns me as the PIC for the day or a particular leg to be flown. I too feel this is conservative even if I do 50% of the flying and take an approach to landing. However, it would be easier to explain under scrutiny. I think at this juncture of most of our careers (judging from the experience I read) we are not looking for every .1 of PIC we can get.

The only real question I have is when flying with an instructor or check airman are they logging PIC time or can they log I time and let you legally log PIC time?

 

Well said. There truly should only be 1 person at a time logging PIC, anything other than that is a true manipulation of the FAR's and going to be hard to explain in an interview.

 

When the FAA Chief Counsel says, "Accordingly, two or more pilots may each log PIC time for the same flight time," I'm not sure that the word "manipulation" really applies, and if you have difficulty at an interview it only shows your lack of understanding of the rules - if I didn't understand something, whether FARs or systems in a King Air, I'd avoid the subject also.

Bottom line:

If you already have your ATP it doesn't matter. Your PIC time, from an FAA standpoint is irrelevant. There aren't any FAA currency requirements I know of that require PIC time and you might as well log per what the airlines will want you to tell them on an application (assuming they are consistent with each other; if not you might as well have a dozen logbooks).

OTOH, if you are still a low-timer working on your instrument rating, commercial or ATP, you're only short-changing yourself. If you want to fly and pay for extra hours instead of using the FAA's rules to meet the FAA's requirements that's absolutely your prerogative. But, with all the anti-PFT sentiment around, it's seems to me to be a little ironic to force yourself to pay for those extra hours if you don't have to.

 

Good. You should be. Here's the weird part: You may be violating the FARs and falsifying your logbook if you are not also the pilot flying. That's not really very conservative.

 

I agree. but that only applies to single pilot airplanes where there is no opspec requirement for an SIC. When the type or opspec requires 2 pilots the PIC (name on release) logs pic even if he is asleep. Air carriers alternate legs between Capt/FO so it would be ridiculous to say that the captain cant log PIC when the FO is flying.

Ref.
61.51 (E) (iii) When the pilot, except for a holder of a sport or recreational pilot certificate, acts as pilot in command of an aircraft for which more than one pilot is required under the type certification of the aircraft or the regulations under which the flight is conducted

 

I don't believe this happened, at least in the way that you're portraying it.

 

So do you think then it is ok to not only log PIC time when you sign the release form but also if you are assigned as the FO for the leg/day for the time you are manipulating the controls?

What I was implying before is that these guys feel that when we are not flying a sortie for a customer whose contracts stipulates two pilots then the King Air reverts back to a single piloted aircraft as it was type certificated that way. And therefore, only one pilot can legally log the PIC time. The contradictory opinion of some at the office is that because there are two type rated captains (we fly the king airs over 12,500 lbs often) that both can log the PIC time whether or not the mission has a requirement for two pilots.

Thoughts? and thank you for clarification. I have spent the majority of my time flying military hardware and am delving into the FAR/AIM slowly.

 

In that type of operation, the only time two pilots on board the same aircraft operating as flight crewmembers can log PIC at the same time is when one of them is a flight instructor providing flight training (So, yes an instructor may log PIC time along with you as long as you are "rated" in the aircraft).

A Co-Captain situation would not warrant both pilots logging PIC time concurrently.

"Some have said both qualified captains log PIC."

Wrong, unless in a flight training scenario. (Part 61/91)

 

Thank you for the clarification.