joseolay

If the credit line window is 75-85 hours during PBS and you want max days off, how would you bid? High credit trips?

Upntheair27

Yes except only very senior people would get these. And at PSA there are very few high time trips. So good luck with that 😁

joseolay

Since you said yes to max days off, lets assume you get awarded an 82 hour line. Your lowest credit trip is 18 hours with 14 days off. Good luck trading up for higher credit trips in the SAP and you can't do a direct drop without going below 65. Simply shifting days around could mean lower monthly credit for the same amount of days off.

Irishblackbird

Nothing is guaranteed, but it won't go down without a fight. 2020? That's 2 years away. It's hard to tell what the next 6 months have instore. If you are basing your desire to come here solely on SAP, that could be risky. I will admit, that SAP is geat, but there are other airlines out there now with better pay and contracts (Endeavor being one). Every pilot I have flown with except maybe one, doe's not want to lose sap, and will not sell it for cheap if it comes to a vote.

WhiteMorpheus

That's why the partial trip drop might need to be considered, allowing people to split trips (obviously, within some parameters, i.e. ending your trip at a hub/crew base, not an outstation). To retain flexibility in SAP it's almost a necessity assuming PBS wouldn't build the extra SAP opentime lines with a bunch of 1, 2, and 3 day trips.

FlyyGuyy

2020? I think the contract is good through 2023.

BizJet

*Just to show you both rumors*

It might be gone in the next few months. Several senior CAs have said that management took SAP off the table for any new LOAs or contracts moving forward.

I 100% want it to stay. But with events of the last few months and our ever worsening reliability it's dead.

For us to get any new flying beyond ****ty 200 routes we have to become more reliable. Right now the pilots hold the gun and management wants it back.

Irishblackbird

You are right. I think the OP was inquiring if SAP would still be here until 2020, maybe basing his decision to come here if it would still be around for 2 years.

Irishblackbird

I'm cofused. Are you saying that management doesn't care about sap anymore and will leave it in place? Or, do you mean that management won't even negotiate with us for any new improvements in our contract and LOA's if we don't agree to get rid of sap?

When they talk about our reliability, I wonder if they factor into the equation that maintenance has been in negotiations, and the multiple deferrals that our planes operate with. How many flights in the 200 were canceled this summer because the apu was inop? How many flight's are cancelled due to maintenance? How about scheduling and the crap trips they build. Did we have an eccessive amount of cancelation's over the holidays in the past? No. Sounds more like a mismanagement of our fleet if they keep building sh!ty 200 lines when the majority of our fleet is 700/900.

There is more to our reliability than just pilots and SAP. We are over 1500 pilots and so far not one day went critical in DAY for FO's in Nov, and I don't see one day critical for Dec yet either.

Is sap not contractual? I don't think management can just up and get rid of Sap, or they would have gotten rid of it along time ago.

BizJet

It's contractual.

The rumor that I've heard from multiple people is that any future LOA will have language to restrict or shut down SAP.

But we are really really good at random rumors. Only time will tell. Like I said I want SAP to remain unchanged.

I've only heard the reliability issue during the last MEC All Call. Someone asked along the lines of why we arn't getting any new flying besides 200. The answer was that our pilot reliability and uncovered flying rates are the highest among the AAG carriers because of SAP.

I'd love to see the numbers but we arn't privy to that data.