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idlethrust 07-31-2020 08:03 AM


Originally Posted by GA2Jets (Post 3102538)
You seem very bearish on ZW all the time. What's with that? Not that it's definitely going to survive or anything but still, you always seem convinced of the worst.

Nooe, not at all , however I don’t live in a fantasy world either .
In order for ZW to survive this someone is gonna have to get down on all 4s, bend over and go under the desk with a Bibb on if you catch my drift . It’s gonna be tough . Adding the 700 isn’t a lifesaver . Mesa , SkyWest and gojet all fly it too so once again cost will be the determining factor as shown with c5 and ev . With those four , it would be a safe assumption that Zw’s cost and payroll are probably the highest .

Gone Flying 07-31-2020 08:03 AM


Originally Posted by GA2Jets (Post 3102538)
You seem very bearish on ZW all the time. What's with that? Not that it's definitely going to survive or anything but still, you always seem convinced of the worst.

I mean didn’t AWAC sign a 4 year deal with UAL in early 2017? Not sure when the 4 years starts/ends (somewhere between Q1 2021- Q1 2022) but I don’t know how bullish I’d be right now. I really hope I’m wrong, I’ve got a few friends at AWAC and crews have always been great to me. Hopefully things turn around before COVID Claims another airline

ZeroTT 07-31-2020 08:29 AM

4 year contract is only good if

1) there aren’t meaningful escape clauses
2) United isn’t willing to play hardball and just break the contract leaving AWAC’s estate to pursue them in court

tonsterboy5 07-31-2020 09:08 AM


Originally Posted by idlethrust (Post 3102405)
ZW is in the same boat as EV, very top heavy , a lot of 15-20 year lifers left.
Very expensive pilot group
gonna be interesting

ZW is in the same boat except for the fact that if ZW is losing money it means nothing to UA. If ExpressJet or commutair are losing money United is losing money. ZW losses money, their owners lose money. Express and commute lose money united loses money. United is trying to save their money, they could care less about others losing money.

dremaldent 07-31-2020 09:51 AM


Originally Posted by tonsterboy5 (Post 3102599)
ZW is in the same boat except for the fact that if ZW is losing money it means nothing to UA. If ExpressJet or commutair are losing money United is losing money. ZW losses money, their owners lose money. Express and commute lose money united loses money. United is trying to save their money, they could care less about others losing money.

ZW doesn't care about losing money in the short-term. To the owners, the airline is an investment. ZW doesn't need to stay profitable throughout this to stay alive, it just needs a war chest to limp along until it can be profitable again.

tonsterboy5 07-31-2020 10:02 AM


Originally Posted by dremaldent (Post 3102622)
ZW doesn't care about losing money in the short-term. To the owners, the airline is an investment. ZW doesn't need to stay profitable throughout this to stay alive, it just needs a war chest to limp along until it can be profitable again.

that’s my point, ZW can limp along at a loss for the next few years knowing they will come out of the other side with less competition. The companies that are either partly or wholly owned by major or ones that are publicly traded have a lot more pressure to break even or make a profit at all cost. Short term United had to get rid of something it was dumping money into to show investors that’s its doing everything it can so save money.

SonicFlyer 07-31-2020 11:25 AM


Originally Posted by rickair7777 (Post 3102526)
Don't make the mistake of assuming that working for an owned regional gives you any kind of special status (other than maybe nonrev priority). It's usually the opposite at crunch time.

Interesting perspective. Can you expand on this, cite some examples possibly?

ZeroTT 07-31-2020 11:30 AM


Originally Posted by SonicFlyer (Post 3102678)
Interesting perspective. Can you expand on this, cite some examples possibly?

it’s fairly straightforward. Let’s say you sign a two-year cell phone contract with Verizon. And you also pay your son the same amount per month to mow the yard.you lose your job, who do you stop paying?

Burt123 07-31-2020 11:50 AM


Originally Posted by SonicFlyer (Post 3102678)
Interesting perspective. Can you expand on this, cite some examples possibly?

Famous last words of a Comair pilot

pitchtrim 07-31-2020 11:57 AM

I'm not so sure ZW has that many super senior people around after the last few years of hiring into the majors and elsewhere. They aren't as top heavy as they once were.


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