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11-19-2008 | 12:45 PM

#91

bryris

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Joined: May 2008

Posts: 714

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From: Hotel

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dan64456

lol. some like to travel tho... Thanks for the good wishes... it's a long and challenging road ahead.. But just know that I was making 6.50 an hour not more than 4 years ago... Yes I am only 24, but I really haven't lived in about 4 years. Corporate jobs take your soul. just ask anyone. And the time I was making 6.50 an hour was the best time of my life... much better than today even with making a tad more than 3 times that...

Travel only gets you there, you need money when you get there.

For me, free travel is sort of like eating 3 chocolate cakes every day, for the benefit of getting an extra slice of chocolate cake. I'd rather take a road trip, honestly.

11-19-2008 | 12:59 PM

#92

AirWillie

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Joined: Nov 2005

Posts: 1,111

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From: MD80

Quote:

Originally Posted by Icelandair

Honestly Bryris arguing with someone who hasn't spent a day in his life at an airline is a bit akin to trying to describe to someone else what it is like to be in a car accident. The other fellow can never ever really know until he wrecks his own car one day.

I knew when I was 18 and single that I would be the 1 out of 5000 who makes it to UPS, when the reality of life made me one of the other 4999 and looking at regional FO status for about 13 years if I don't bail soon.

You know what Iclendair, I started a reply for chrish and the guy with the nw airbus on his avatar but I erased it all. You've said best. They don't know. Why would someone who is actually doing what they are currently DREAMing of doing, telling them this isn't a good job and it's certainly not worth it?? For what we have to put up with, gone 2/3 of the month, 60K is NOTHING. Unless you live in a poor area of the country, 60K with a wife and kids is nothing more than lower middle class. That's not what you went to school for and sacrificed to become a pilot. And you will not get to 60K in less than 5 years. You will live in poverty untill then. We're not even talking about major salaries, assume you will NEVER get there. To compare civilian jobs with 1st or second year at a reputable major like Delta or UPS is just stupid and naive because you will probably never get there.

Last edited by AirWillie; 11-19-2008 at 01:19 PM.

11-19-2008 | 01:04 PM

#93

AirWillie

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Joined: Nov 2005

Posts: 1,111

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From: MD80

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dan64456

I strongly doubt the nay sayers ever worked in an office job before... 5 day work weeks plain suck. The negative people fail to count the time for commuting / overtime / whatever as well when making numbers up for a 9 to 5er... I don't see how you say that you only get 30 hours off per week either... Here is the schedule of a regional FO I know thats only been working at the airline for less than 1 year...

Oct 1st...OFF

Oct 2nd
Dep..........Arr
LAX 1130...SBA 1219
SBA 1252...LAX 1345
LAX 1425...SBA 1512
SBA 1554...LAX 1645

Oct 3rd
Dep..........Arr
LAX 0950...SBP 1054...Could be my last flight to San Luis Obispo for the Month
SBP 1121...LAX 1230
LAX 1325...SAN 1427...Could be my last flight to San Diego for the Month
SAN 1455...LAX 1545

Oct 4th
Dep..........Arr
LAX 0800...SBA 0846
SBA 0917...LAX 1010
LAX 1130...SBA 1219
SBA 1252...LAX 1345
LAX 1425...SBA 1512
SBA 1554...LAX 1645

Oct 5th
Dep..........Arr
LAX 0800...SBA 0846
SBA 0917...LAX 1010
LAX 1130...SBA 1219
SBA 1252...LAX 1345
LAX 1425...SBA 1512
SBA 1554...LAX 1645

Oct 6th...OFF
Oct 7th...OFF
Oct 8th...OFF
Oct 9th...OFF

Oct 10th
Dep..........Arr
LAX 0800...SBA 0846
SBA 0917...LAX 1010
LAX 1130...SBA 1219
SBA 1252...LAX 1345
LAX 1425...SBA 1512
SBA 1554...LAX 1645

Oct 11th
Dep..........Arr
LAX 0800...SBA 0846
SBA 0917...LAX 1010
LAX 1130...SBA 1219
SBA 1252...LAX 1345
LAX 1425...SBA 1512
SBA 1554...LAX 1645

Oct 12th
Dep..........Arr
LAX 0800...SBA 0846
SBA 0917...LAX 1010
LAX 1130...SBA 1219
SBA 1252...LAX 1345
LAX 1425...SBA 1512
SBA 1554...LAX 1645

Oct 13th...OFF
Oct 14th...OFF
Oct 15th...OFF

Oct 16th
Dep..........Arr
LAX 0800...SBA 0846
SBA 0917...LAX 1010
LAX 1130...SBA 1219
SBA 1252...LAX 1345
LAX 1425...SBA 1512
SBA 1554...LAX 1645

Oct 17th
Dep..........Arr
LAX 0800...SBA 0846
SBA 0917...LAX 1010
LAX 1130...SBA 1219
SBA 1252...LAX 1345
LAX 1425...SBA 1512
SBA 1554...LAX 1645

Oct 18th
Dep..........Arr
LAX 0800...SBA 0846
SBA 0917...LAX 1010
LAX 1130...SBA 1219
SBA 1252...LAX 1345
LAX 1425...SBA 1512
SBA 1554...LAX 1645

Oct 19th
Dep..........Arr
LAX 0800...SBA 0846
SBA 0917...LAX 1010
LAX 1130...SBA 1219
SBA 1252...LAX 1345
LAX 1425...SBA 1512
SBA 1554...LAX 1645

Oct 20th...OFF
Oct 21st...OFF
Oct 22nd...OFF
Oct 23rd...OFF

Oct 24th
Dep..........Arr
LAX 0800...SBA 0846
SBA 0917...LAX 1010
LAX 1130...SBA 1219
SBA 1252...LAX 1345
LAX 1425...SBA 1512
SBA 1554...LAX 1645

Oct 25th
Dep..........Arr
LAX 0800...SBA 0846
SBA 0917...LAX 1010
LAX 1130...SBA 1219
SBA 1252...LAX 1345
LAX 1425...SBA 1512
SBA 1554...LAX 1645

Oct 26th
Dep..........Arr
LAX 0800...SBA 0846
SBA 0917...LAX 1010
LAX 1130...SBA 1219
SBA 1252...LAX 1345
LAX 1425...SBA 1512
SBA 1554...LAX 1645

Oct 27th...OFF
Oct 28th...OFF
Oct 29th...OFF

Oct 30th
Dep..........Arr
LAX 0800...SBA 0846
SBA 0917...LAX 1010
LAX 1130...SBA 1219
SBA 1252...LAX 1345
LAX 1425...SBA 1512
SBA 1554...LAX 1645

Oct 31st
Dep..........Arr
LAX 0800...SBA 0846
SBA 0917...LAX 1010
LAX 1130...SBA 1219
SBA 1252...LAX 1345
LAX 1425...SBA 1512
SBA 1554...LAX 1645

15 days off, and home every single night of the week. some WORKdays he can even sleep in! I'm up at 6:30 every damn morning, and always tired. Only get to sleep in 2 days per week, and never can sleep past 7:30am anyway because of being used to forcing myself out of bed EVERY weekday.

I still don't see any validity in your arguments either... no offense, but I'm just trying state my case here...

I honestly think (like the other guy said) that the people that whine never worked in a real job (aside from aviation) before...

This guy is flying SAABS as an FO. He makes below poverty wages. Not enough to sustain yourself let alone a family. Also this is a very specialized example which you will never get to since SAABs don't even fly at LAX anymore.

11-19-2008 | 01:22 PM

#94

GlobeTreker

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Joined: Sep 2008

Posts: 320

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From: Auto

I remember my fatasy world

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dan64456

What about the fact that a lot people will be turning 65 in 4 years now? (since they raised the age...)

Also I don't really care if I get to a major airline or not. Would I like to? You bet... Better cities, better pay, better equipment...

But I'd be more than content with a regional as a career too... In 3 - 5 years 60 or 70 grand a year... In 10 to 15 years... 100 grand a year (More than I'll EVER make in my current career), top of seniority list, and hot young FA's rather than the old bag's at the majors...

Being captain of a Q400 would be amazing to me. Growing up like I did (lower middle class), I never thought any of this was ever possible. I always thought the best thing I'd ever be able to do is be a cable guy or something like that... Then one day I realized I was good at fixing computers and understanding networks and anything electronic for that matter... Then bamm, got my private pilot license. Never even thought that was a possibility!

So being at a regional would be jackpot for me...

10 to 15 years at a regional eh? You would be lucky to work at one that stays in business that long.
The comment about "better" equipment at a major. I would say the EMB 170 is a lot more advanced than a DC-9 or MD-80.
The best part was about the hot young flight attendants. Haaaaaaahaaaaa ahaaaaaaaaaaaa. Boy are you in for a rude awakening. Most of them are either old, gay, from the hood, or a combination of the three. They occasionally sprinkle a young hottie in there. For every hot flight attendant, there are 50 uglies.

You will learn the harsh realities of this business if you stay with your "dream".

11-19-2008 | 01:32 PM

#95

Lighteningspeed

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Joined: Sep 2007

Posts: 1,206

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From: G550 Captain

I like to fly just like a lot of us here. But there is no way people starting out today as a professional pilot will ever make as much they would in non flying jobs. If you are just starting out with PPL, you are going to be spending at least $25,000 to $30,000 by the time you get your INSTRUMENT, COMM SEL, MEL, CFI, CFII, CFI MEL. Then you would have to pay dues as a CFI for at least a year before you have enough hours to apply to regionals where you would make around $25,000 a year. This is assuming regional hiring will remain as brisk as it has been in 2007. In 2009 and beyond chances are you would be competing against a lot of guys with prior Part 121 experience who were furloughed from their airline jobs. My regional is even getting applications from furloughed major airline pilots with thousands of hours in jets. My regional is full of 15 year plus seniority CAs who never made it to the majors.

Now if you went and obtained an MBA or a law degree, you would start out at $80,000 a year to start. How do I know this? I used to date a girl who got her law degree and her first job with a law firm paid $87,000 to start with full benefits like paid 2 week paid vacations and full health care coverage.

I am not saying this to discourage you but if you have a family, you need to think about them first. Ask yourself, is the risk worth taking?

11-19-2008 | 01:53 PM

#96

GlobeTreker

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Joined: Sep 2008

Posts: 320

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From: Auto

another reality check

If you are married. You can guarantee at least 12 nights a month you won't be getting any action at home. Enjoy those lonely nights at the Radisson with your laptop and hand lotion. Meanwhile, your buddy the computer programmer is pulling down as much as the almighty regional captain and he get to get with momma any time he wants.

On a side note. Is that crappy salary you will make worth the average of 144 nights you won't be able to tuck your children in bed? I hope that $31 per hour at CAL (if you make it that far) is worth missing out on every holiday your friends and family will be celebrating without you while you sit ARC in Newark.

This jet jockey is on his way out. I won't be looking for a cubicle job either. Cubicle jobs keep getting referenced here. There is such a thing called entrepreneurs ya know. There is truly unlimited income potential in running your own business.

11-19-2008 | 01:57 PM

#97

insanelyradical

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Joined: Mar 2007

Posts: 30

Likes: 0

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rascal

Improved the situation? As opposed to you...Working like slave and asking for morewill not improve the situation for other CFI's.

I love responses like this. You must be the guy that made 60K a year and only flew cross countries in the twin when you were instructing, then upgraded to an 80K first year FO spot. It is called paying your dues and works that way in nearly every industry. Sure there are better places than others but not everyone can get the best job out there. All i'm saying is you can expect to get crapped on for awhile when trying to break into any industry and this one is no different. This board nearly kept me out of flying though and I just don't want to see that happen to someone else just because someone says that it sucks. Just trying to give a different perspective to the guys interested other than the negetive nancies on here. Take it for what it is worth. I'm just a lowly instructor.

11-19-2008 | 01:58 PM

#98

ThunderChicken

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Joined: Jun 2008

Posts: 110

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From: A320

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lighteningspeed

Sounds like to me you should still be dating her.

11-19-2008 | 02:16 PM

#99

stoki

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Joined: Feb 2008

Posts: 771

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From: bar stool

I think I face palmed myself like 40 times reading this thread.

I hope mangaement isnt reading this thread, as they might drop salaries and T&Cs even further as apparently the job is still as appealing to some people as a playboy model sprawled out on your bed.

Good to see so many satisfied with the pay levels, and even in admiration of them.

11-19-2008 | 02:17 PM

#100

Airbum

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Joined: Dec 2005

Posts: 674

Likes: 8

Quote:

Originally Posted by Icelandair

I was going to respond but you have pretty much summed up what I was going to say. I have been one of the luckier ones I know but mostly because we have not fallen as far as some.