PDT News and Rumors
#4711
Line Holder
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 60
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I am not making a big deal out of it, but since you insist.
PSA took concessions under the premise that they would get growth flying at the expense of Eagle as the airplanes they were awarded "were" supposed to have gone to Eagle if we would have accepted the B scale.
Eagle has said no twice , after the first time management went to PSA, they came back to Eagle and we said no again. One of the threats used against the Eagle pilots was that PDT could see airplanes, and management is on the record stating that they would like to refleet the wholly owned regionals. I understand that PSA signing this letter has mixed feelings, but my concern is not so much PDT not signing it, but rather the timing. So close to Eagle and others saying NO, while AAG seeks someone to fly their large RJs that are to replace routes currently flown by Eagle.
My concern is that as pilots, regional pilots but specifically AAG regional pilots... we are negotiating against our selves and management is trying to divide and ensure that there is no unity between the three pilot groups. When PSA negotiated their last deal they separated from the rest of the industry as they did their deal, I am wondering if the same thing is happening at PDT. This is the intent of management, and we are hurting each others careers and negotiating against our collective futures.
PSA took concessions under the premise that they would get growth flying at the expense of Eagle as the airplanes they were awarded "were" supposed to have gone to Eagle if we would have accepted the B scale.
Eagle has said no twice , after the first time management went to PSA, they came back to Eagle and we said no again. One of the threats used against the Eagle pilots was that PDT could see airplanes, and management is on the record stating that they would like to refleet the wholly owned regionals. I understand that PSA signing this letter has mixed feelings, but my concern is not so much PDT not signing it, but rather the timing. So close to Eagle and others saying NO, while AAG seeks someone to fly their large RJs that are to replace routes currently flown by Eagle.
My concern is that as pilots, regional pilots but specifically AAG regional pilots... we are negotiating against our selves and management is trying to divide and ensure that there is no unity between the three pilot groups. When PSA negotiated their last deal they separated from the rest of the industry as they did their deal, I am wondering if the same thing is happening at PDT. This is the intent of management, and we are hurting each others careers and negotiating against our collective futures.
First and foremost, no ALPA contract is valid without the association president's signature. He will ultimately sign a contract at a regional that is in the best interest of the mainline carrier(s) it feeds. The less that feed costs, the lower the cost to the mainline carrier, and the more money that is left over for mainline pay. In our history, that's the reason why Airways Group had Piedmont acquire Allegheny. The Allegheny contract (arguably one of the best, if not the best in ALPA), cost more. With the exception of the Piedmont vacation language, it was far superior. Simple ALPA economics: The association president signed it because it benefitted the mainline carrier. That is and always has been the unspoken conflict that exists within our union.
People complain all the time about Mesa's bottom feeding contract, and PSA dropping their pants yet again. But you don't hear any complaints from ALPA's Executive Council. The president signs contracts that aid and abet our professions race to the bottom at the regional level.
The fact that BF didn't sign the solidarity letter means absolutely nothing.
If you look at ALPA from arms length and follow the money, you will see that institutionally the main line member carriers are the captains, and the regionals are the F/Os. Given the opportunity to influence F/O wages to their advantage, which way do you think they'll turn?
Follow the money.
#4714
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 2,168
Likes: 0
From: Reclined
The FFD meeting did not release the letter until the PDT MEC Chairman refused to sign it. That's what my sources say; he refused to sign. That's when it was sent out as is.
I'm also hearing that AAG may be in discussions with them soon, if they aren't already to send some 175's there.
AAG wants desperately to send planes elsewhere in an effort to say "we told you so" to the envoy pilots.
They may have a deal for 10 with an outside non AAG vendor in the works, which buys them time to get a deal with PDT and for PDT to spin up a training program. PDT has estimated 18 months for both a training and Maint program.
Eventually PDT will be folded into envoy. The CRJ's that went to PSA were never destined for envoy. The envoy pilots and their MEC have voted no THREE (3) times already against concessions. Each time under threat of losing flying and potentially their jobs. The rest of the FFD pilots need to follow the lead of envoy, XJT and RAH.
Potentially getting new planes (from envoy) is why PDT did not sign.
You PDT pilots need to get all over your MEC.
I'm also hearing that AAG may be in discussions with them soon, if they aren't already to send some 175's there.
AAG wants desperately to send planes elsewhere in an effort to say "we told you so" to the envoy pilots.
They may have a deal for 10 with an outside non AAG vendor in the works, which buys them time to get a deal with PDT and for PDT to spin up a training program. PDT has estimated 18 months for both a training and Maint program.
Eventually PDT will be folded into envoy. The CRJ's that went to PSA were never destined for envoy. The envoy pilots and their MEC have voted no THREE (3) times already against concessions. Each time under threat of losing flying and potentially their jobs. The rest of the FFD pilots need to follow the lead of envoy, XJT and RAH.
Potentially getting new planes (from envoy) is why PDT did not sign.
You PDT pilots need to get all over your MEC.
Last edited by Mason32; 04-19-2014 at 04:40 AM.
#4715
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 579
Likes: 0
The FFD meeting did not release the letter until the PDT MEC Chairman refused to sign it. That's what my sources say; he refused to sign. That's when it was sent out as is.
I'm also hearing that AAG may be in discussions with them soon, if they aren't already to send some 175's there.
AAG wants desperately to send planes elsewhere in an effort to say "we told you so" to the envoy pilots.
They may have a deal for 10 with an outside non AAG vendor in the works, which buys them time to get a deal with PDT and for PDT to spin up a training program. PDT has estimated 18 months for both a training and Maint program.
Eventually PDT will be folded into envoy. The CRJ's that went to PSA were never destined for envoy. The envoy pilots and their MEC have voted no THREE (3) times already against concessions. Each time under threat of losing flying and potentially their jobs. The rest of the FFD pilots need to follow the lead of envoy, XJT and RAH.
Potentially getting new planes (from envoy) is why PDT did not sign.
You PDT pilots need to get all over your MEC.
I'm also hearing that AAG may be in discussions with them soon, if they aren't already to send some 175's there.
AAG wants desperately to send planes elsewhere in an effort to say "we told you so" to the envoy pilots.
They may have a deal for 10 with an outside non AAG vendor in the works, which buys them time to get a deal with PDT and for PDT to spin up a training program. PDT has estimated 18 months for both a training and Maint program.
Eventually PDT will be folded into envoy. The CRJ's that went to PSA were never destined for envoy. The envoy pilots and their MEC have voted no THREE (3) times already against concessions. Each time under threat of losing flying and potentially their jobs. The rest of the FFD pilots need to follow the lead of envoy, XJT and RAH.
Potentially getting new planes (from envoy) is why PDT did not sign.
You PDT pilots need to get all over your MEC.
#4717
Pdt would definitely accept concessions for new planes for other reasons than psa. Very senior pilot group need 5 or 10 more years to retire, willing to take concessions so their not out on the street. Unlike psa pdt is in dire circumstances to survive, planes will cycle out in a few years and pdt is small enough to shut down over a no vote and noone would even notice. Psa was chasing shiny jets and upgrades but pdt needs a life raft to cling on to. However I doubt they'll ever see an offer.
#4718
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 2,168
Likes: 0
From: Reclined
PDT can get raises all around, and still be cheaper than any other jet operator. It will be vital for them to not accept less than they're worth. I'd suggest that whomever has the best contract, (probably Air Wiskey), should be the starting point for discussions and improvements. It's obvious they can't place these things as easily as they claimed. You guys are no longer replaceable at will. Stand together, and you will win the day.
#4719
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,648
Likes: 0
I don't see PDT voting down a contract that includes raises (even if lower than other jet operators) a flow similar to what was offered to Eagle (which I assume will be included) and new aircraft to refleet them. I could be wrong but it seems like quite a stretch for them to turn something like that down.
#4720
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