Global Express - First Officer Pay

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Quote: Take a chill pill there, buddy! First of all, 85K first year is a lot of money, I don't care what you tell me. Could it be higher? Sure, why not. The more the merrier. So if making 8K a month isn't decent, what are you going to do to change it? What are you going to do to make the salaries more suitable? Because if you're not being proactive in changing things then you're just as guilty as the mentalities you speak of. We could go on all day long about what salaries should or shouldn't be, but what actions are you taking to improve them?
What you fail to realize is that this aircraft is the crème de la crème of corporate flying. This aircraft and the GV are the height of a corporate pilot's salary. There are no 747/777/A380's in corporate flying like what an airline pilot has the potential to fly. For those pilots that stay in corporate there whole carriers there is no aircraft that commands more money and by somebody coming in at flying it 2/3 price it is the equivalent of being an airline scab that crosses a picket line. This hurts pilots as a whole. The damage done by someone who agrees to much less salries brings the whole industry down. If you want to make 85k go fly a Cl-600/601 it is very similar to an RJ and pays is largely a domestic airplane. Just remember when the airline's hire you back your life goes back to normal meanwhile you leave the carrier corporate guys with a lower standard of living because you sold out. I don't mean this as a personal attack on anyone; I am just trying to keep the standards up on the corporate end.
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I think the main point is being missed here. There's a big difference between a type rated guy with time-in-type and a guy who has no corporate experience that's going to have to be babysat for a year and eventually sent to school to be typed (which costs a small fortune in itself). Comparing these two is like apples and oranges and salaries would WIDELY vary. 85k for a low time guy who's gonna need a babysitter is pretty good IMHO.
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If you're only a CFII and pass up an opportunity to make 85k and get some GLEX time you're crazy. Not saying you should work for free, but there will be plenty of guys waiting in line to take it if you don't. With the amount of pilots on the street and considering this economy, I'd say beggars shouldn't be too choosy. If anyone is selling out here I'd say it's the Captain or chief pilot of this flight department that's willing to put an unqualified guy in the right seat of their multimillion dollar jet. Most owners/companies willing to spend that kind of money on a jet want both pilots to be able to fly the thing by themselves. Having both captain qualified pilots often vastly reduces insurance costs also.
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Quote: Any GLEX or GV operation who hires a cfi is an operation you don't want to work for..

probably will experience:

- cheap hotels
- bad training
- insane duty days
- poor treatment from the owner and chief pilot
- threats against your job if you ask for more money
- never upgrade to PIC

anyone want to add to this list?
Ha ha ha. I was thinking the exact same thing. There's gotta be something fishy if a GLEX operator is hiring a CFI.

........but, could it be worse than flight instructing?
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Quote:
Not saying you should work for free, but there will be plenty of guys waiting in line to take it if you don't. With the amount of pilots on the street and considering this economy, I'd say beggars shouldn't be too choosy.

Ugh, this attitude KILLS our industry!!...If you are qualified for a position, and are offered a sub par salary, you should have the right to demand to be compensated accordingly for your skills and services, and not have to worry about someone else trying to undercut you for a job!...I'm not sure what the solution is, but we've got to get guys to just not be willing to work for sub par wages...I understand there are many pilots out of work, and any job is better than no job, but accepting a sub par wage will only hurt EVERYONE in the future, when things get better.....As someone said earlier, if you are flying the crem-de-la-crem of corporate aircraft, you need to be compensated in such a way....

P.s......there should NEVER EVER be a comparison of corparate salaries to regional or airline salaries, no matter what airplane, no matter what seat!.....
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Quote: What you fail to realize is that this aircraft is the crème de la crème of corporate flying. This aircraft and the GV are the height of a corporate pilot's salary. There are no 747/777/A380's in corporate flying like what an airline pilot has the potential to fly. For those pilots that stay in corporate there whole carriers there is no aircraft that commands more money and by somebody coming in at flying it 2/3 price it is the equivalent of being an airline scab that crosses a picket line. This hurts pilots as a whole. The damage done by someone who agrees to much less salries brings the whole industry down. If you want to make 85k go fly a Cl-600/601 it is very similar to an RJ and pays is largely a domestic airplane. Just remember when the airline's hire you back your life goes back to normal meanwhile you leave the carrier corporate guys with a lower standard of living because you sold out. I don't mean this as a personal attack on anyone; I am just trying to keep the standards up on the corporate end.
While I agree the global is fun to fly(at least the sim at FSI) its not the top of the corporate lader. Large companies such as Boeing and various other companies have BBJ's such as the 737'7/8/900's outfitted for 20-30 people. Race teams such as RCR and Hendricks have B727's and CRJ's, Indian princes and African Kings have 757's outfitted with gold sinks and full bed rooms these are the top of the corporate lader! However as an entry level pay, key word being entry level pay at $85k is almost at standards for the global.
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Quote: Ha ha ha. I was thinking the exact same thing. There's gotta be something fishy if a GLEX operator is hiring a CFI.

........but, could it be worse than flight instructing?
Fishy indeed. A global F/O would still need high times for insurance? The operator would pay out the nose for insurance to hire someone who does not have experience.
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Quote: While I agree the global is fun to fly(at least the sim at FSI) its not the top of the corporate lader. Large companies such as Boeing and various other companies have BBJ's such as the 737'7/8/900's outfitted for 20-30 people. Race teams such as RCR and Hendricks have B727's and CRJ's, Indian princes and African Kings have 757's outfitted with gold sinks and full bed rooms these are the top of the corporate lader! However as an entry level pay, key word being entry level pay at $85k is almost at standards for the global.
You are greatly misinformed if you think 85k is entry level. I am not typed and was offered 110 just a month ago. Not having a type qualifies you as "entry level". This aircraft is the top tier of corporate jets. The few BBJ's out there are reserved for a select few pilots and they are usually retired airline guys who have great retirement packages but still want to fly. Tell yourself what ever you need to to sleep at night but by excepting that job at that pay you are doing an injustice to the corporate jet industry. Just like a scab does to the airline industry!!
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Tangent question,

What would be the total cost(plane, crew costs, fuel, mx, insurance, etc) for a aircraft flying a part 91 operation(400 flight hours a year) to the middle east area. A ballpark figure for a low end aircraft(two ish fuel stops) to a high end aircraft(nonstop if possible).

Thanks and sorry bout the tangent question, I thought it kinda related to the op question on a/c basis and international talk.
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Quote: Ugh, this attitude KILLS our industry!!...If you are qualified for a position, and are offered a sub par salary, you should have the right to demand to be compensated accordingly for your skills and services, and not have to worry about someone else trying to undercut you for a job!...I'm not sure what the solution is, but we've got to get guys to just not be willing to work for sub par wages...I understand there are many pilots out of work, and any job is better than no job, but accepting a sub par wage will only hurt EVERYONE in the future, when things get better.....As someone said earlier, if you are flying the crem-de-la-crem of corporate aircraft, you need to be compensated in such a way....

P.s......there should NEVER EVER be a comparison of corparate salaries to regional or airline salaries, no matter what airplane, no matter what seat!.....
That's my whole point. If this guy is just a CFI then he's not qualified to be flying a corporate Global. That's why I'd say he's crazy to pass up the opportunity if there's a flight department wacko enough to put him in one. If you think any CFI is gonna pass up an opportunity to jump into a large corporate jet, even if the pay is sub-par, I want some of what you're smokin'. Not saying it's right, it's just reality.

.....and I agree with your point of not comparing Regional to Corporate pay. Apples and Oranges.
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