watcher444

Last thought then back to permanent lurking:

SW has picked a fight and it seems they are going to get one.

The art of fighting is for leadership to realistically assess one’s strength through unclouded eyes.

For the pawns, it’s about not being led to the grave by leadership that is insulated by the potential consequences due to their lifetime status(SAPA lifers).

There WILL be consequences when you pick a fight with a much larger, hardened, and capable group(UAL pilots). Especially when the hand that feeds YOU is being injured.(UAL Mgmt).

Al Czervik

Just defending the profession from stupidity. I think the jumpseat war is what may not end well.

symbian simian

I don't want to start a legal argument, so I will give you my opinion for clarification, and everyone is entitled to have a few of those:

You don't decide who flies the aircraft, you're not directly hiring/training or paying the pilot, so you have ceded control of the front seats, and again IMO that includes the JS. IMO you aren't the owner of the aircraft, so using the term own-metal is appropriate language to use in reference to the JS.
You are in control of every seat in the back (and for me that would include all non-rev priority) and when and where the plane goes, but that doesn't "cause" ownership. I am just arguing semantics here.

On where the priority for the JS should be:
On mainline and exclusive:
1) Own
2) Mainline other same exclusive.
3) OAL

Non-exclusive: for example SKW-UA:
1) SKW
2) UA/UAX-exclusive (either DOH or TOC, whatever the mainline carrier decides)
3) OAL including all other non-exclusive, not okay to get priority on every carrier out there just because you might fly for all of them.

symbian simian

Just replied to a few of your posts, agree totally with this one.

ebl14

Exactly right, and back on point. There will only be one group hurt in this war. Just wait until their non-rev bennies are on the chopping block and see how fast their lines are broken.

This is the high point for SAPA and the Skywest pilots, it’s all downhill from here on out.

Gone Flying

[/QUOTE]
3) OAL including all other non-exclusive, not okay to get priority on every carrier out there just because you might fly for all of them.[/QUOTE]

I get priority on DL and UA for the same reason a UA pilot gets priority on every UAX carrier: my airline does business with and supports that airline. I should get priority on UA over a spirit pilot because I support the UA system, same as every OO pilot. same with DL. AA should too but that is a whole other dumpster fire. Since AA does not give me priority above OAL on their JS my FOM treats them as OAL on my JS

ebl14

So you just want them to sign the agreement then, right?

Gone Flying

3 changes i see
1) United has the power to put must ride people in the js
2) i get a lower priority on UA flights than before
3) UA gets higher priority on us than before

1 is an absolute non starter unless they are willing to provide the displaced pilot a seat in the back ( lets say they use this for an audit or something)
2 is not right either. my company has 179 planes flying for UAX and has continuously been operating as united express since the 90s, i can be bumped by a dispacher for air Wisconsin, an airline that has 60-70 planes and just started flying for UA a few years ago( for the 2nd time).
3) I have no problem with and honestly suprised it worked this way when I got hired here. on UAX flights it should be
1)Own metal
2)UAL
3)UAX
4)OAL
with that said I would also like to see UA have a cutoff time of 15 mins prior to D0 like DL (since so many talk about industry standard) so i cannot be pulled of the jumpseat at D-3 (by a pilot with a pos space on the next flight no less)

EDIT: it looks like UA is not even asking for elevated priority on OO or RAH JS which I would think to be the most reasonable request of them all. it will be only UAX exclusive carriers that will have this

Gone Flying

not going to quote but why are you posting identifying info about this flight?

uaav8r

It’s called a blacklist