Serious thoughts about leaving.
11-19-2021, 02:20 PM
#91
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2015
Posts: 123
Originally Posted by Sluggo_63
FedEx guy:
December schedule (in the midst of our peak). 20 days off in 35 day month. So I guess you could normalize that as 18 off in a 31 day month. Credit of 99 hours. 53 hours of block. Long haul international.
December schedule (in the midst of our peak). 20 days off in 35 day month. So I guess you could normalize that as 18 off in a 31 day month. Credit of 99 hours. 53 hours of block. Long haul international.
11-19-2021, 08:44 PM
#92
On Reserve
Joined APC: Jun 2013
Position: Left
Posts: 22
Originally Posted by rightseat
There are 19,000 pilots flying at regional airlines. The military also has 19,000 pilots. There are probably an equal number fractionals, charters, small 135’s, and other niche markets. There a total of 103,879 commercial pilots in the US.
Getting to ANY of the big four is and will likely always be a coveted position for nearly all of these folks at some point in their career. Which ones the best, again it depends on your personal circumstance and then secondly the contract, and third comes the upgrade time in my opinion.
Most of us at SW at year five make over $200k by year five. That is more than 90% of the households in the US. I would just say, that quality of life is far more important than the money if you are in the top 10% of wage earners. Jockeying for the best career, should be a lot more about qol than money in my opinion.
Anyone in this industry will tell you seniority is king. If you are looking to leave any time after two years in a hiring boom (which is what we are in) you better study your options VERY closely. A wrong move will cost you dearly.
Over the last ten years, each of the top four have been considered “THE” place to go for a period of time. If history is any teacher, that will occur again in the next ten years. My advice is take the first major that calls and settle in for the long haul with the best one that fits you within two years. If you don’t live in base at SW and can with another carrier, pack your bags if you can. Other than that, if you are outside of the two year window, your seniority will likely trump any benefit in the greener pastures.
Getting to ANY of the big four is and will likely always be a coveted position for nearly all of these folks at some point in their career. Which ones the best, again it depends on your personal circumstance and then secondly the contract, and third comes the upgrade time in my opinion.
Most of us at SW at year five make over $200k by year five. That is more than 90% of the households in the US. I would just say, that quality of life is far more important than the money if you are in the top 10% of wage earners. Jockeying for the best career, should be a lot more about qol than money in my opinion.
Anyone in this industry will tell you seniority is king. If you are looking to leave any time after two years in a hiring boom (which is what we are in) you better study your options VERY closely. A wrong move will cost you dearly.
Over the last ten years, each of the top four have been considered “THE” place to go for a period of time. If history is any teacher, that will occur again in the next ten years. My advice is take the first major that calls and settle in for the long haul with the best one that fits you within two years. If you don’t live in base at SW and can with another carrier, pack your bags if you can. Other than that, if you are outside of the two year window, your seniority will likely trump any benefit in the greener pastures.
11-19-2021, 09:56 PM
#93
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Posts: 2,847
Originally Posted by ZapBrannigan
I think the most junior Captain is around 600 senior to me, but there are over 800 FOs bypassing right now. So I think it’ll be a while.
I think you’ll be surprised in Spring/Summer how many are still bypassing.
11-20-2021, 12:28 AM
#94
Line Holder
Joined APC: Aug 2020
Posts: 91
Originally Posted by ROFF
After 4+ years I’m giving serious consideration of another airline. After seeing what’s happening at other airlines in terms of upgrades, progression and contracts it’s hard to ignore what’s happening here. The arrogance of management has me wondering about the future of this company and prospects for a fulfilling career. There were certain draws here several years ago that made up for some shortcomings but navigating this COVID crisis has shown that this company is NOT the company many of us thought it was.
Thoughts?
Thoughts?
11-20-2021, 03:29 AM
#95
Gets Weekend Reserve
Joined APC: Jul 2007
Posts: 3,616
Originally Posted by YangGang2020
HAL is hiring street wide body FOs. Wide body Captain is 7 years. NB captain is 2. You can beat cost of living by living on the big island.
Did you guys ever make any progress on that first year pay?
11-20-2021, 03:50 AM
#96
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2010
Position: DOWNGRADE COMPLETE: Thanks Gary. Thanks SWAPA.
Posts: 6,615
Originally Posted by flyguy81
I know quite a few Sr FO’s who are going to bypass. Don’t want to sit rsv on weekends, get crappy vacation and miss kids’ activities when for the foreseeable future they can make $300k+ as a Sr. FO.
I think you’ll be surprised in Spring/Summer how many are still bypassing.
I think you’ll be surprised in Spring/Summer how many are still bypassing.
11-20-2021, 03:53 AM
#98
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2010
Position: DOWNGRADE COMPLETE: Thanks Gary. Thanks SWAPA.
Posts: 6,615
Originally Posted by Sluggo_63
FedEx guy:
December schedule (in the midst of our peak). 20 days off in 35 day month. So I guess you could normalize that as 18 off in a 31 day month. Credit of 99 hours. 53 hours of block. Long haul international.
December schedule (in the midst of our peak). 20 days off in 35 day month. So I guess you could normalize that as 18 off in a 31 day month. Credit of 99 hours. 53 hours of block. Long haul international.
11-20-2021, 05:04 AM
#99
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2019
Posts: 249
Originally Posted by WHACKMASTER
I don’t know why this is constantly discussed ad nauseam. The bypass ratio will always be there as long as senior FOs are making as much or almost as much as junior captains and they’re not trying to get PIC time to go somewhere else.
I don’t understand your guys math. A senior FO can make as much as a junior captain BUT WILL WORK MORE FOR IT. Ok let’s take a look at some math:
a 95 tfp reserve line for a captain is equivalent to 136 tfp for a senior FO. I am using MAX 12 year pay for a captain at 245 tfp and 171 tfp for an fo. But let’s say the fo gets a line (cause he is senior) with 21 days off at 95 tfp. Which is a base month. The avg reserve guys are doing today about 125 tfp (that’s with minimum 15 off). So if you take that 245x125 tfp your at 30,625. So for an FO to do that he is going to need 179 tfp. We previously agreed the avg senior line for an FO is 21 days off. So if you take his minimum monthly guarantee of 95 he is going to need 84 tfp EXTRA to make the 179. So even if he gets premium that pays 10 a day (which is very hard to get). He is going to have to work a MINIMUM OF 8 EXTRA DAYS!!! So his 21 off becomes 13 off that’s being gracious and giving him 10 tfp per day of work. I am a very junior captain and I was a very senior FO for a very long time. I can assure you a senior FO can make as much as a junior captain. But he/she will work alot harder for it then a junior captain commuting. This notion that a reserve line just pays 95 is INCORRECT and misleading. You get whatever pays higher. The average reserve lines today are in the 120’s. A year ago even during the height of Covid they were In the 100’s. A 3 day block of reserve pays 18 a 3 day trip pays 19.5. So if he/she gets called out for a 3 day right away their pay increases 1.5 tfp! Most senior FO’s I have come across realize this and hence are taking first available.
11-20-2021, 05:14 AM
#100
Line Holder
Joined APC: May 2015
Posts: 94
I never worked as much as a reserve line and get to pick the days I want to work. I’ll make over 300k. Plus bidding every vacation week I want that will pay over 50 tip for
each week (two that paid over 60) The minor pay increase is not worth it for a commute across the country.
each week (two that paid over 60) The minor pay increase is not worth it for a commute across the country.
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