I definitely want to try that type of flying but what I’m noticing is being a CA here (UAL) is probably 10x easier than being a CA at NK, lol. Everyone does what they’re supposed to, scheduling isnt working from home, (they actually Get rid of Frost on the A/C before you show up, IMAGINE THAT!!, DX isnt filing you through lines of weather, there’s always food and theres so much variety in trips that even going to work sometimes isnt bad. So WB F/O sounds great but upgrading is going to be the easiest Job I’ll ever have. The CAs here do way less than we did at NK. It’s so painful (I mean not really but you know what I mean) being an F/O to these mid twenty something CAs who have been in the industry for 3 years but hopefully Im not stuck in this seat against my will for long….

 

But back to attrition....

Do you guys have a good internal way to see how many folks are actually leaving or have actually left?

feel like there has to be movement all over the map at Spirit that may make it difficult to tell how many folks are leaving, but would hope that as classes actually start elsewhere you could see the real movement on some type of official roster and hopefully that mitigates furloughs and/or downgrades. Our main seniority list only gets updated once per year at UA, but you can see who has left by looking at monthly base roster info, not sure if you guys have something that makes it easier to discern the actuall attrition.

If the rumors we are hearing at UA apply to DL and AA about the New Hire class make ups then hopefully there will be less actuall furloughs and downgrades to those that stay.

 

With your background and what you recently went through, I truly appreciate everything you wrote, but there is a reason that you're sitting next to some twenty somethings, and it's not because...

Everything is relative. I heard a lot about WB being a different airline, how good the QOL is, etc, but you truly don't appreciate any of it until you experience it. They say to go WB FO when you're able to hold NB left seat with the seniority you want for QOL so, if you can't manage your rest and it kicks your ***, you can upgrade. The problem is that if it suits you it is difficult to think about going back to multiple legs, airplane swaps, inbound is late, short overnights, etc. So many more dynamics to eff up a day, trip, etc. I imagine similar to if you were a CA now with the more efficient operation and had to then operate in the NK environment. What you used to deal with as a matter of fact is now exponentially more painful😂
Occasionally I look at the NB CA PBS awards for my seniority, and while not horrible, I do question wanting to go back to that mess.

Having said all that, if anything will push me back, it will be missing flying - honestly. I really wish there were a middle ground.

 

I like it

public school grad here

 

why is "today" different than hired in 2022 or 2023?

the Big-3 retirements, especially UAL and AA, are still 800+ a year for the next few years.

 

Just thought I’d also mention to this forum that Breeze today are newly advertising for A220 FO’s
See their website for details
With International expansion near and more A220’s on the way this might be worth a look.
They have hired a few Spirit Pilots already.
Cheers

 

AA still looking at roughly 1k a year for a few years and then it trails off into the 5-700 range for a few more years before things fall off dramatically.

 

ok, then this example may be appropriate

Occupants (all awesome folks) occupy a boat (previously leak proof and well built) that has, well, a leak

Rescue helicopter flies over. It has "Hiring Boom 2022 Pick Your Airline" painted on the door. "Do you need help"

Nah, but thank you. We are gonna try to get this fixed. "Ok, we are out of here"

Months later, the leak continues, land is nowhere to be seen and storm clouds exist on the distant horizon.

"We should have told that rescue helicopter we needed help"

"Yeah, we SHOULD have. But it is too late now. That rescue helicopter may never come back, so lets just embrace this situation"

soon, another rescue helicopter, with "HIRING CONTINUING BUT MAY SLOW" painted on the door flies over. "Hey do you guys need help down there?"

best of luck brothers

 

I'm not knocking the legacies, but a lot of what you describe primarily applies to the multi-day trips at NK.

Doing mostly day turns you won't deal with nearly as many headaches. It's pretty much show up, fly two legs and walk back to the car after setting the parking brake. Most of the time I don't even see the FAs working in the back.

Occasionaly I may time out and get stuck, but honestly that is mabye once a year for me.

Overall I am much more healthy being home most nights: eating real food at home, working out in my local gym, going for a run on the beach, sleeping in my own bed, etc...

I am no stranger to the 4 day trip life, and I don't miss the hotels and garbage airport food. It's just not for me and I get sick more often living that kind of lifestyle.

WB flying did interest me at some point, but knowing what that kind of flying does to the body I think I would pass if it were an option.

It doesn't look cool and sexy on IG, but non-redeye NB out and backs are about the healthiest kind of flying one can do. However if all one cares about is running up the W2 every year, then the legacies are the way to go. No question about it.


Obviously if NK ceases to exist then none of this matters.


EDIT: Please don't rebut this with the outlier 27.5 year CA who lives in base at xzy legacy and who just started doing day turns toward the end of his/her career. I realize this is possible but I am discussing the kind of flying that one can reasonably do for the bulk of their career in a tax friendly red state.

 

all good points. Well said