Spirit of NKS
03-10-2015, 05:10 PM
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Joined APC: Dec 2005
Posts: 8,898
As a follow up question, booking the JS with the online method. It showed none listed and 1 available. Now that if it is booked is it true that it's yours unless a Spirit guy gets on at the airport and bumps you? Or does it go by first come, first serve at the airport for OAL regardless of when you booked online?
03-10-2015, 05:29 PM
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Joined APC: Oct 2010
Posts: 4,603
OAL should go by time of check in but not many agents nor captains know this because we go by time of listing.
03-10-2015, 05:30 PM
Line Holder
Joined APC: Dec 2014
Posts: 93
Originally Posted by ShyGuy
As a follow up question, booking the JS with the online method. It showed none listed and 1 available. Now that if it is booked is it true that it's yours unless a Spirit guy gets on at the airport and bumps you? Or does it go by first come, first serve at the airport for OAL regardless of when you booked online?
03-10-2015, 05:32 PM
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Joined APC: Dec 2014
Posts: 93
Originally Posted by ManFlex
Who knows. If true, the AFA should have pushed to have OAL F/A's allowed to occupy the F/A jumpseat instead of disallowing OAL pilots from occupying the F/A jumpseat. Granting this courtesy could come with more reciprocal agreements for their F/A group.
Not enough room in the life rafts to support the additional jumpseat, so says the riddle guys.... might be true
As an aside, is there any chance we could get the second cockpit jumpseat reinstalled at some point? As this pilot group grows, we are only going to have more commuters.
Not enough room in the life rafts to support the additional jumpseat, so says the riddle guys.... might be true
As an aside, is there any chance we could get the second cockpit jumpseat reinstalled at some point? As this pilot group grows, we are only going to have more commuters.
03-10-2015, 07:04 PM
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Joined APC: Jun 2010
Posts: 1,577
Originally Posted by NedsKid
I'm wondering who is the weak sister that let the AFA castrate our PIC authority.
I was wondering the same thing. Probably the same person that allowed the F/A jumpseat belongs to the Spirit Flight Attendants verbiage in the FOM.
Maybe we should hire AFA to negotiate for us.
Then again, that would cause an endless "me too" loop, so never mind.
03-10-2015, 09:40 PM
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Joined APC: Mar 2011
Position: Underemployed!
Posts: 116
Originally Posted by Hugedouche
Not enough room in the life rafts, so says the riddle kids.. who knows if it true but sounds possible
It's only partially based in fact, but I don't believe it's the reason for a single jumpseat. It has 4 slide rafts with a 44 people capacity each, and a single remote raft with a 13 people capacity, for a total capacity of 189. Clearly enough room for 178 people, a crew of 6 and 2 jumpseats. However, FAR 25 requires a sufficient overload capacity to accomodate all occupants with the loss of a raft of the highest capacity. With the loss of a single slide raft, and 3 remaining rated for 55 overloaded, and the remote capacity is 20 overloaded, for a total of 185. 178+6 crew is 184, leaving room for 1 jumpseater. But that alone doesn't keep them from installing a second jumpseat, you just couldn't have someone occupy the seat, if full in the back, going beyond 50 miles offshore with the current raft compliment in use.
How do we know that? The 321 has the same 4 slide rafts, and 2 remote rafts capable of 25 each, for a total capacity of 226. Subtract the 218 seats, and a crew of 7, leaves you room for 1 jumpseater, yet it has 2 jumpseats installed. Oddly enough, it's 2 remote rafts are rated for 38 overloaded each, giving the 321 a loss/overload capacity of 241. Simply exchanging the 320's remote raft for one like the 321 carries would solve the problem, if the raft truly was the reason for a single jumpseat. Either way, raft capacity doesn't define seating capacity or configuration, simply how many people you can carry going beyond the 50 nm range from shore. The FAR's overwater required equipment references total occupants, not total seating capacity.
At the end of the day, we work for Spirit, the single jumpseat is a cost savings measure, nothing more.
Btw, I did hear of a flight where a captain called dispatch to reroute them inland to accomodate a second jumpseater on a full 321 flight from LGA to FLL. Not sure if it's true, but if so, great thinking on the captain's part to help a guy get where he needed to go. That's truly a "no pilot left behind" mentality we should all hope to offer!
03-10-2015, 10:19 PM
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Joined APC: Mar 2015
Position: Low paid Airbus gear slinger
Posts: 815
Originally Posted by EricJ320
This is a rumor I hear often regarding the single jumpseat on the 320 that really needs to be put to bed!
It's only partially based in fact, but I don't believe it's the reason for a single jumpseat. It has 4 slide rafts with a 44 people capacity each, and a single remote raft with a 13 people capacity, for a total capacity of 189. Clearly enough room for 178 people, a crew of 6 and 2 jumpseats. However, FAR 25 requires a sufficient overload capacity to accomodate all occupants with the loss of a raft of the highest capacity. With the loss of a single slide raft, and 3 remaining rated for 55 overloaded, and the remote capacity is 20 overloaded, for a total of 185. 178+6 crew is 184, leaving room for 1 jumpseater. But that alone doesn't keep them from installing a second jumpseat, you just couldn't have someone occupy the seat, if full in the back, going beyond 50 miles offshore with the current raft compliment in use.
How do we know that? The 321 has the same 4 slide rafts, and 2 remote rafts capable of 25 each, for a total capacity of 226. Subtract the 218 seats, and a crew of 7, leaves you room for 1 jumpseater, yet it has 2 jumpseats installed. Oddly enough, it's 2 remote rafts are rated for 38 overloaded each, giving the 321 a loss/overload capacity of 241. Simply exchanging the 320's remote raft for one like the 321 carries would solve the problem, if the raft truly was the reason for a single jumpseat. Either way, raft capacity doesn't define seating capacity or configuration, simply how many people you can carry going beyond the 50 nm range from shore. The FAR's overwater required equipment references total occupants, not total seating capacity.
At the end of the day, we work for Spirit, the single jumpseat is a cost savings measure, nothing more.
Btw, I did hear of a flight where a captain called dispatch to reroute them inland to accomodate a second jumpseater on a full 321 flight from LGA to FLL. Not sure if it's true, but if so, great thinking on the captain's part to help a guy get where he needed to go. That's truly a "no pilot left behind" mentality we should all hope to offer!
It's only partially based in fact, but I don't believe it's the reason for a single jumpseat. It has 4 slide rafts with a 44 people capacity each, and a single remote raft with a 13 people capacity, for a total capacity of 189. Clearly enough room for 178 people, a crew of 6 and 2 jumpseats. However, FAR 25 requires a sufficient overload capacity to accomodate all occupants with the loss of a raft of the highest capacity. With the loss of a single slide raft, and 3 remaining rated for 55 overloaded, and the remote capacity is 20 overloaded, for a total of 185. 178+6 crew is 184, leaving room for 1 jumpseater. But that alone doesn't keep them from installing a second jumpseat, you just couldn't have someone occupy the seat, if full in the back, going beyond 50 miles offshore with the current raft compliment in use.
How do we know that? The 321 has the same 4 slide rafts, and 2 remote rafts capable of 25 each, for a total capacity of 226. Subtract the 218 seats, and a crew of 7, leaves you room for 1 jumpseater, yet it has 2 jumpseats installed. Oddly enough, it's 2 remote rafts are rated for 38 overloaded each, giving the 321 a loss/overload capacity of 241. Simply exchanging the 320's remote raft for one like the 321 carries would solve the problem, if the raft truly was the reason for a single jumpseat. Either way, raft capacity doesn't define seating capacity or configuration, simply how many people you can carry going beyond the 50 nm range from shore. The FAR's overwater required equipment references total occupants, not total seating capacity.
At the end of the day, we work for Spirit, the single jumpseat is a cost savings measure, nothing more.
Btw, I did hear of a flight where a captain called dispatch to reroute them inland to accomodate a second jumpseater on a full 321 flight from LGA to FLL. Not sure if it's true, but if so, great thinking on the captain's part to help a guy get where he needed to go. That's truly a "no pilot left behind" mentality we should all hope to offer!
If that captain story is true, buy that man a beer. Two beers.
No pilot left behind
BTW - when we getting more 321s?
03-11-2015, 04:55 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2014
Posts: 166
Originally Posted by Rainbows
i just thought it was because spirit is too cheap to pay for that extra seat. they cant sell that seat so no sense in havin it.
If that captain story is true, buy that man a beer. Two beers.
No pilot left behind
BTW - when we getting more 321s?
If that captain story is true, buy that man a beer. Two beers.
No pilot left behind
BTW - when we getting more 321s?
3 in q3 and 3 in q4.
03-11-2015, 07:33 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2010
Posts: 1,577
Originally Posted by EricJ320
This is a rumor I hear often regarding the single jumpseat on the 320 that really needs to be put to bed!
It's only partially based in fact, but I don't believe it's the reason for a single jumpseat. It has 4 slide rafts with a 44 people capacity each, and a single remote raft with a 13 people capacity, for a total capacity of 189. Clearly enough room for 178 people, a crew of 6 and 2 jumpseats. However, FAR 25 requires a sufficient overload capacity to accomodate all occupants with the loss of a raft of the highest capacity. With the loss of a single slide raft, and 3 remaining rated for 55 overloaded, and the remote capacity is 20 overloaded, for a total of 185. 178+6 crew is 184, leaving room for 1 jumpseater. But that alone doesn't keep them from installing a second jumpseat, you just couldn't have someone occupy the seat, if full in the back, going beyond 50 miles offshore with the current raft compliment in use.
How do we know that? The 321 has the same 4 slide rafts, and 2 remote rafts capable of 25 each, for a total capacity of 226. Subtract the 218 seats, and a crew of 7, leaves you room for 1 jumpseater, yet it has 2 jumpseats installed. Oddly enough, it's 2 remote rafts are rated for 38 overloaded each, giving the 321 a loss/overload capacity of 241. Simply exchanging the 320's remote raft for one like the 321 carries would solve the problem, if the raft truly was the reason for a single jumpseat. Either way, raft capacity doesn't define seating capacity or configuration, simply how many people you can carry going beyond the 50 nm range from shore. The FAR's overwater required equipment references total occupants, not total seating capacity.
At the end of the day, we work for Spirit, the single jumpseat is a cost savings measure, nothing more.
Btw, I did hear of a flight where a captain called dispatch to reroute them inland to accomodate a second jumpseater on a full 321 flight from LGA to FLL. Not sure if it's true, but if so, great thinking on the captain's part to help a guy get where he needed to go. That's truly a "no pilot left behind" mentality we should all hope to offer!
It's only partially based in fact, but I don't believe it's the reason for a single jumpseat. It has 4 slide rafts with a 44 people capacity each, and a single remote raft with a 13 people capacity, for a total capacity of 189. Clearly enough room for 178 people, a crew of 6 and 2 jumpseats. However, FAR 25 requires a sufficient overload capacity to accomodate all occupants with the loss of a raft of the highest capacity. With the loss of a single slide raft, and 3 remaining rated for 55 overloaded, and the remote capacity is 20 overloaded, for a total of 185. 178+6 crew is 184, leaving room for 1 jumpseater. But that alone doesn't keep them from installing a second jumpseat, you just couldn't have someone occupy the seat, if full in the back, going beyond 50 miles offshore with the current raft compliment in use.
How do we know that? The 321 has the same 4 slide rafts, and 2 remote rafts capable of 25 each, for a total capacity of 226. Subtract the 218 seats, and a crew of 7, leaves you room for 1 jumpseater, yet it has 2 jumpseats installed. Oddly enough, it's 2 remote rafts are rated for 38 overloaded each, giving the 321 a loss/overload capacity of 241. Simply exchanging the 320's remote raft for one like the 321 carries would solve the problem, if the raft truly was the reason for a single jumpseat. Either way, raft capacity doesn't define seating capacity or configuration, simply how many people you can carry going beyond the 50 nm range from shore. The FAR's overwater required equipment references total occupants, not total seating capacity.
At the end of the day, we work for Spirit, the single jumpseat is a cost savings measure, nothing more.
Btw, I did hear of a flight where a captain called dispatch to reroute them inland to accomodate a second jumpseater on a full 321 flight from LGA to FLL. Not sure if it's true, but if so, great thinking on the captain's part to help a guy get where he needed to go. That's truly a "no pilot left behind" mentality we should all hope to offer!
03-11-2015, 07:39 AM
escaped
Joined APC: Aug 2011
Posts: 227
Originally Posted by EricJ320
This is a rumor I hear often regarding the single jumpseat on the 320 that really needs to be put to bed!
At the end of the day, we work for Spirit, the single jumpseat is a cost savings measure, nothing more.
Btw, I did hear of a flight where a captain called dispatch to reroute them inland to accomodate a second jumpseater on a full 321 flight from LGA to FLL. Not sure if it's true, but if so, great thinking on the captain's part to help a guy get where he needed to go. That's truly a "no pilot left behind" mentality we should all hope to offer!
At the end of the day, we work for Spirit, the single jumpseat is a cost savings measure, nothing more.
Btw, I did hear of a flight where a captain called dispatch to reroute them inland to accomodate a second jumpseater on a full 321 flight from LGA to FLL. Not sure if it's true, but if so, great thinking on the captain's part to help a guy get where he needed to go. That's truly a "no pilot left behind" mentality we should all hope to offer!
Excellent explanation and heart warming story.
Leave no one behind!
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