Spirit of NKS, Part II
09-09-2016 | 03:45 AM
#8781
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 378
Likes: 0
From: A320 Right
I find it rich when people defend the NC secrecy and then don't say why it's necessary. It's always a vague bunch of myths.
Many if there are any risks in disclosing the opening position it far outweighs the dangers posed by lack of transparency.
What you guys don't get is there would not be a need for any of this if we knew what the heck was going on.
And save the "call your rep" song and dance.
Many if there are any risks in disclosing the opening position it far outweighs the dangers posed by lack of transparency.
What you guys don't get is there would not be a need for any of this if we knew what the heck was going on.
And save the "call your rep" song and dance.
09-09-2016 | 04:26 AM
#8782
Line Holder
Joined: Mar 2016
Posts: 66
Likes: 0
I find it rich when people defend the NC secrecy and then don't say why it's necessary. It's always a vague bunch of myths.
Many if there are any risks in disclosing the opening position it far outweighs the dangers posed by lack of transparency.
What you guys don't get is there would not be a need for any of this if we knew what the heck was going on.
And save the "call your rep" song and dance.
Many if there are any risks in disclosing the opening position it far outweighs the dangers posed by lack of transparency.
What you guys don't get is there would not be a need for any of this if we knew what the heck was going on.
And save the "call your rep" song and dance.
I have little confidence in this NC. Remember these are the guys that just a few months ago told the pilot group that it was to expensive to fix slope.
There is no logical reason to hide the "ask" other than they are using the junior pilots to subsidize higher top end rates. These guys are smart they know whatever TA comes to a vote at this point will be voted in. I would be happy to admit that I am wrong if they publish the "ask" but at this point that's the only thing that makes sense to me.
BTW I don't give a crap who has an LEC, who signs a petition, any of it. I want to know that the union is working for all.
09-09-2016 | 04:26 AM
#8783
Banned
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 177
Likes: 0
From: A320 Captain
Uh oh, Doug Polletti is back in full force!! Enjoying his suspension from Spirit I see. Anger management is available through the HIMS program Doug, check it out!
09-09-2016 | 04:29 AM
#8784
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 130
Likes: 0
From: Airbus Left
I find it rich when people defend the NC secrecy and then don't say why it's necessary. It's always a vague bunch of myths.
Many if there are any risks in disclosing the opening position it far outweighs the dangers posed by lack of transparency.
What you guys don't get is there would not be a need for any of this if we knew what the heck was going on.
And save the "call your rep" song and dance.
Many if there are any risks in disclosing the opening position it far outweighs the dangers posed by lack of transparency.
What you guys don't get is there would not be a need for any of this if we knew what the heck was going on.
And save the "call your rep" song and dance.
Your chance to approve or disapprove will come when we see a TA.
09-09-2016 | 04:46 AM
#8785
Line Holder
Joined: Sep 2016
Posts: 41
Likes: 0
Nice try Audi. You've always lacked credibility. Impartial third parties have called you out in the past. Character matters!
09-09-2016 | 04:48 AM
#8786
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 4,603
Likes: 0
APC is officially unusable now.
09-09-2016 | 04:50 AM
#8787
Line Holder
Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 75
Likes: 0
From: A320 FO
09-09-2016 | 04:55 AM
#8788
Line Holder
Joined: Sep 2016
Posts: 41
Likes: 0
For the record, I would love to know what "the ask" is, but I know that it's just not a good idea to publish that. Negotiations are never simple. We simply will not get everything we want, but I'm confident that we can get a good deal that we can vote on.
You already have a say via your rep. We had a say when we took the survey. You get another say, when it comes time to vote on a TA. For most reasonable people, this is enough of a democratic process to satisfy them. Is the slope too steep? Yeah. However, it might take more than 1 negotiating cycle to fix it. If we stomp our feet and demand demand demand, this isn't negotiating and it will result in being put on ice - guaranteed! The deck is already stacked against us with the RLA, now you guys want to stack it even higher with Audi and MH's twisted rhetoric?
You already have a say via your rep. We had a say when we took the survey. You get another say, when it comes time to vote on a TA. For most reasonable people, this is enough of a democratic process to satisfy them. Is the slope too steep? Yeah. However, it might take more than 1 negotiating cycle to fix it. If we stomp our feet and demand demand demand, this isn't negotiating and it will result in being put on ice - guaranteed! The deck is already stacked against us with the RLA, now you guys want to stack it even higher with Audi and MH's twisted rhetoric?
09-09-2016 | 04:59 AM
#8789
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 130
Likes: 0
From: Airbus Left
Yep. Basically what Justmeagain is saying is that this pilot group isn't smart enough to be involved in the negotiations.
I have little confidence in this NC. Remember these are the guys that just a few months ago told the pilot group that it was to expensive to fix slope.
There is no logical reason to hide the "ask" other than they are using the junior pilots to subsidize higher top end rates. These guys are smart they know whatever TA comes to a vote at this point will be voted in. I would be happy to admit that I am wrong if they publish the "ask" but at this point that's the only thing that makes sense to me.
BTW I don't give a crap who has an LEC, who signs a petition, any of it. I want to know that the union is working for all.
I have little confidence in this NC. Remember these are the guys that just a few months ago told the pilot group that it was to expensive to fix slope.
There is no logical reason to hide the "ask" other than they are using the junior pilots to subsidize higher top end rates. These guys are smart they know whatever TA comes to a vote at this point will be voted in. I would be happy to admit that I am wrong if they publish the "ask" but at this point that's the only thing that makes sense to me.
BTW I don't give a crap who has an LEC, who signs a petition, any of it. I want to know that the union is working for all.
Look, it would do you or me no good if we knew the "ask". It's most likely pretty high as it should be, but things will change for better or worse in the course of negotiations. My least favorite rep, JA, tried to cater to our "great urge to know" last year. We kept hearing things like "we are very close", "we are only xxx dollars apart", etc. That certainly backfired on us, didn't it.
Let the NC do their job - you will have your say in the end.
09-09-2016 | 05:07 AM
#8790
Banned
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 177
Likes: 0
From: A320 Captain
It's funny actually, counting all the people including myself arguing about this and there might be 10 of us, even with the multiple screen names some of you have, lol. I don't think as many of our pilots see or hear or care about our opinions on here, there is another 1400 out there not even seeing this. I always wonder why I even care enough to respond anymore, but I do. I do actually care about the future here at Spirit and am sick and tired of the lies deceit, and hidden political agendas. My only agenda is to make the process open and honest for all of us. My other agenda item is to get an industry leading contract! Let's not settle for less. 100% retro benefits all of us. Btw, I do not ever want a job at ALPA, too boring.
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