Spirit of NKS, Part II
09-08-2016 | 07:24 AM
#8741
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 110
Likes: 0
Is Audi2000 the same guy who created this change.org petition? Who the **** does he think he is, sounds like he needs to be on a no fly list.
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09-08-2016 | 07:37 AM
#8742
Line Holder
Joined: Sep 2016
Posts: 41
Likes: 0
Careful! Audi will accuse us of being the same person! Audi claims that they just used MH's change.org account for the petition - he wasn't directly involved......
09-08-2016 | 07:52 AM
#8743
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 195
Likes: 0
Even a broken clock is right twice a day. Teamsters were in trouble at RAH because of Sowell and TM (business agent). Everyone knew it and several moved against them, only to be accused of "seditious weasleyism (sp?)". Gene held all the cards and eventually Teamsters put the local into trusteeship. It improved after this, but was occasionally hijacked by people who overreached. I'll give an example: asking for more than any other regional airline pilots were getting = mediator putting you on ice. RAH management was adept at working with codeshare partners, to shift flying to others in order to help them stave off the union demands and inability to staff. Eventually, they got a decent group of guys that made something happen. Is it an awesome agreement? No. It's a good step in the right direction though. This is why negotiations dragged on over there.
If you were there for only 12 months, why do I remember your name? Could it be that you were a prolific abuser of the message board? It didn't take a genius to see that RAH wasn't a great place to be and you're no genius!
By the way, I would encourage everyone that believes in DFW having their own LEC to demand that they be shown the SPAALPA finances. Ask yourself some objective questions:
How much dues income does SPAALPA generate?
How much does it cost to run an LEC?
How much income for ALPA does each base generate?
Now look at Spirit's finances:
Which bases are the biggest income generators for Spirit?
Which bases are under the most revenue pressure from our competitors?
Everyone should get educated about the finances of ourselves and Spirit. The $2.5 million MCF that we were able to secure from ALPA will be coming from whom? Delta/United/FedEx Pilots, that's who? We can't afford another LEC at this time. We wouldn't be be good stewards of other's money! Period.
If you were there for only 12 months, why do I remember your name? Could it be that you were a prolific abuser of the message board? It didn't take a genius to see that RAH wasn't a great place to be and you're no genius!
By the way, I would encourage everyone that believes in DFW having their own LEC to demand that they be shown the SPAALPA finances. Ask yourself some objective questions:
How much dues income does SPAALPA generate?
How much does it cost to run an LEC?
How much income for ALPA does each base generate?
Now look at Spirit's finances:
Which bases are the biggest income generators for Spirit?
Which bases are under the most revenue pressure from our competitors?
Everyone should get educated about the finances of ourselves and Spirit. The $2.5 million MCF that we were able to secure from ALPA will be coming from whom? Delta/United/FedEx Pilots, that's who? We can't afford another LEC at this time. We wouldn't be be good stewards of other's money! Period.
What does an lec need to operate? Election every 3 years.
4 meetings a year(trip drops/hotels)
Mec meetings (trip drops/hotels)
Communication? (Everything is digital)
The random representation of pilots that costs some trip drop.
In the big scheme of things, it's not all that much considering the lack of representation for all pilots. Just my .02
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09-08-2016 | 07:56 AM
#8744
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 758
Likes: 1
By the way, I would encourage everyone that believes in DFW having their own LEC to demand that they be shown the SPAALPA finances. Ask yourself some objective questions:
How much dues income does SPAALPA generate?
How much does it cost to run an LEC?
How much income for ALPA does each base generate?
Now look at Spirit's finances:
Which bases are the biggest income generators for Spirit?
Which bases are under the most revenue pressure from our competitors?
Everyone should get educated about the finances of ourselves and Spirit. The $2.5 million MCF that we were able to secure from ALPA will be coming from whom? Delta/United/FedEx Pilots, that's who? We can't afford another LEC at this time. We wouldn't be be good stewards of other's money! Period.
You know the truth or you wouldn't be asking the question. Why not just post the facts vs some politically motivated BS? Could it be that the facts don't back up the perceptions you hope to create?
For the rest of you, I'll give you this. Frontier has locals at all domiciles. JetBlue has locals at all domiciles. JetBlue even has multiple status reps at JFK in order to provide suitable representation for those pilots.
At other than rapidly evolving/devolving "fee for departure" carriers, ALPA properties include separate locals except for geographically linked areas.
We, SPA ALPA, are the exception. Not the rule.
Edit: just notice squeaky bananas post. Ditto squeaky
Last edited by skybolt; 09-08-2016 at 08:02 AM. Reason: added support for squeaky banana
09-08-2016 | 08:47 AM
#8748
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 171
Likes: 0
So the petition is at about 23%. Say it gets to 50% + 1, then what? If I'm an LEC rep or on the MEC, I shrug my shoulders and say thank you.
There is a pilot all call soon. If retro is important to the majority ask the NC to run a new poll. Let the majority then make clear that retro is a hard ask.
The petition is now caught up in the character of it's proponents, good or bad. If you want the petition to gain traction, you need some new more visible, respected cheerleaders.
It would be great to see 100% full retro, all for it. Also would be great to see 100% participation in LEC elections, NC polling, and so much more.
On LEC4DFW. There are some motivated people, maybe something will happen. The fact the the LEC reps have not met in DFW since 2013 is on them. It would be a great if the MEC met in DFW next.
RECALL. Try it, you might like it.
Were the Frontier and JetBlue reps and councils in place before joining ALPA? Makes a difference. With Frontier shrinking in DEN, would not be surprised if they lost that in the future. National will spend the money when bringing in a new group to the fold. And JetBlue has how many pilots?
Looking at October, DFW, LAS, and ORD are all of similar size. So when does ORD get it's own LEC? And with the new gate construction in ORD, could be some growth there. Any growth coming to DFW?
When the G concourse is finished in 2018, perhaps FLL will double in size. It is already at @400 pilots. Then what?
Having 80 pilots out of @220 based in DFW come out for a local LEC is a start, but it is not a majority.
In the end, even with encouragement from LEC or MEC reps, National will not approve, period. And it will because of the money.
There is a pilot all call soon. If retro is important to the majority ask the NC to run a new poll. Let the majority then make clear that retro is a hard ask.
The petition is now caught up in the character of it's proponents, good or bad. If you want the petition to gain traction, you need some new more visible, respected cheerleaders.
It would be great to see 100% full retro, all for it. Also would be great to see 100% participation in LEC elections, NC polling, and so much more.
On LEC4DFW. There are some motivated people, maybe something will happen. The fact the the LEC reps have not met in DFW since 2013 is on them. It would be a great if the MEC met in DFW next.
RECALL. Try it, you might like it.
Were the Frontier and JetBlue reps and councils in place before joining ALPA? Makes a difference. With Frontier shrinking in DEN, would not be surprised if they lost that in the future. National will spend the money when bringing in a new group to the fold. And JetBlue has how many pilots?
Looking at October, DFW, LAS, and ORD are all of similar size. So when does ORD get it's own LEC? And with the new gate construction in ORD, could be some growth there. Any growth coming to DFW?
When the G concourse is finished in 2018, perhaps FLL will double in size. It is already at @400 pilots. Then what?
Having 80 pilots out of @220 based in DFW come out for a local LEC is a start, but it is not a majority.
In the end, even with encouragement from LEC or MEC reps, National will not approve, period. And it will because of the money.
09-08-2016 | 09:01 AM
#8749
Line Holder
Joined: Sep 2016
Posts: 41
Likes: 0
I know several pilots that signed this petition believing it would add pressure on the company. In fact, it has put our NC in an untenable position. If you signed this petition in error, you can click on the link which was included in your email. It will allow you to unsign the petition. If people are truly happy to put our negotiators in this position, keep your signature on it.
Regarding the DFW LEC financial argument, this is just one aspect of why this is a bad idea. Has DFW grown at all in the past year? (I don't keep track). Is it in danger of stagnation or shrinking? Possibly. The 3 biggest revenue generators are FLL, LAS and ORD in that order. Where will this base be in 2 years? It may be a shadow of what it is today. Take a look at the numbers in each base and tell me why this is a good idea. You are represented now, as are all the pilots in every base. Can you show the group how you aren't represented?
Another base may be opening soon. What if Audi decides that his best interests lie in the new base? Are we going to have to live through another push for representation from him?
I get that you guys want a voice. You, like me, already have one. You had a chance to vote in your reps and didn't. Why?
Regarding the DFW LEC financial argument, this is just one aspect of why this is a bad idea. Has DFW grown at all in the past year? (I don't keep track). Is it in danger of stagnation or shrinking? Possibly. The 3 biggest revenue generators are FLL, LAS and ORD in that order. Where will this base be in 2 years? It may be a shadow of what it is today. Take a look at the numbers in each base and tell me why this is a good idea. You are represented now, as are all the pilots in every base. Can you show the group how you aren't represented?
Another base may be opening soon. What if Audi decides that his best interests lie in the new base? Are we going to have to live through another push for representation from him?
I get that you guys want a voice. You, like me, already have one. You had a chance to vote in your reps and didn't. Why?
09-08-2016 | 09:19 AM
#8750
Banned
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 568
Likes: 0
From: A320
So the petition is at about 23%. Say it gets to 50% + 1, then what? If I'm an LEC rep or on the MEC, I shrug my shoulders and say thank you.
There is a pilot all call soon. If retro is important to the majority ask the NC to run a new poll. Let the majority then make clear that retro is a hard ask.
The petition is now caught up in the character of it's proponents, good or bad. If you want the petition to gain traction, you need some new more visible, respected cheerleaders.
It would be great to see 100% full retro, all for it. Also would be great to see 100% participation in LEC elections, NC polling, and so much more.
On LEC4DFW. There are some motivated people, maybe something will happen. The fact the the LEC reps have not met in DFW since 2013 is on them. It would be a great if the MEC met in DFW next.
RECALL. Try it, you might like it.
Were the Frontier and JetBlue reps and councils in place before joining ALPA? Makes a difference. With Frontier shrinking in DEN, would not be surprised if they lost that in the future. National will spend the money when bringing in a new group to the fold. And JetBlue has how many pilots?
Looking at October, DFW, LAS, and ORD are all of similar size. So when does ORD get it's own LEC? And with the new gate construction in ORD, could be some growth there. Any growth coming to DFW?
When the G concourse is finished in 2018, perhaps FLL will double in size. It is already at @400 pilots. Then what?
Having 80 pilots out of @220 based in DFW come out for a local LEC is a start, but it is not a majority.
In the end, even with encouragement from LEC or MEC reps, National will not approve, period. And it will because of the money.
There is a pilot all call soon. If retro is important to the majority ask the NC to run a new poll. Let the majority then make clear that retro is a hard ask.
The petition is now caught up in the character of it's proponents, good or bad. If you want the petition to gain traction, you need some new more visible, respected cheerleaders.
It would be great to see 100% full retro, all for it. Also would be great to see 100% participation in LEC elections, NC polling, and so much more.
On LEC4DFW. There are some motivated people, maybe something will happen. The fact the the LEC reps have not met in DFW since 2013 is on them. It would be a great if the MEC met in DFW next.
RECALL. Try it, you might like it.
Were the Frontier and JetBlue reps and councils in place before joining ALPA? Makes a difference. With Frontier shrinking in DEN, would not be surprised if they lost that in the future. National will spend the money when bringing in a new group to the fold. And JetBlue has how many pilots?
Looking at October, DFW, LAS, and ORD are all of similar size. So when does ORD get it's own LEC? And with the new gate construction in ORD, could be some growth there. Any growth coming to DFW?
When the G concourse is finished in 2018, perhaps FLL will double in size. It is already at @400 pilots. Then what?
Having 80 pilots out of @220 based in DFW come out for a local LEC is a start, but it is not a majority.
In the end, even with encouragement from LEC or MEC reps, National will not approve, period. And it will because of the money.
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