United diversity.......
04-12-2021, 10:34 AM
#511
Bracing for Fallacies
Joined APC: Jul 2007
Position: In favor of good things, not in favor of bad things
Posts: 3,543
Originally Posted by EMAW
Wanna donate to a non-profit that’s purpose is to expose young ladies to aviation? Know a young lady that would like to go to camp to learn about aviation? Look up Preflight Aviation Camp at preflightcamp.com.
04-12-2021, 11:40 AM
#512
Get me outta here...
Joined APC: Oct 2008
Position: Boeing right seat
Posts: 1,541
Originally Posted by Airhoss
I declare ooofff the winner. She has resorted to the extremely intellectual and impossible to beat debate technique of “I know you are, but what am I.” and “liar liar pants on fire.” . Now if she could say it in Pig Latin and have all of her mean girl friends back her up with eye rolls and talk to the hand gestures, she’d have put a nail in this thread’s coffin! At first I thought ooof was an stubborn, spoiled, child, who was used to getting whatever she wants, but now I see that she is truly a linguistic genius of untold proportions.
04-12-2021, 11:51 AM
#513
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2016
Posts: 774
Originally Posted by BeatNavy
If I made a racist comment, then I would expect to be called a racist, as I explained here. A mod deleted the original comment, so I rewrote the post, essentially saying the same thing, but not using the offensive and triggering R word. But the point stands. Your original comment that someone has to “look like them” in order to be their role model is a _____ comment (insert unoffensive word of your choice that means “judging people by their skin color”). And if you believe that you can only look up to people who “look like you,” then how would you describe yourself....tolerant? Woke? Anti-______?
I think it's perfectly acceptable to think the Tuskegee Airmen inspired black youth. Perfectly acceptable to think that if United's goals are achieved it will inspire girls and black youth.
The discusion of how to achieve that goal, or if it can be achieved is separate from who will be inspired.
If you needed a job, would you be inspired to work for? Would it be Emirates if you saw or heard they hire at least 50% expats? What if you saw or heard only French nationals work for AirFrance? What if AirFrance reported they had 1% expats on property but have no stated goals of who to hire to avoid upsetting French nationals?
Last edited by Happyflyer; 04-12-2021 at 12:11 PM.
04-12-2021, 12:11 PM
#514
Covfefe
Joined APC: Jun 2015
Posts: 3,001
Originally Posted by Happyflyer
Maybe your trying to pin him down to hard to prove a point and not discuss to learn.
I think it's perfectly acceptable to think the Tuskegee Airmen inspired black youth. Perfectly acceptable to think that if United's goals are achieved it will inspire girls and black youth.
The discusion of how to achieve that goal, or if it can be achieved is separate from who will be inspired.
If you needed a job, would you be inspired to work for Emirates if you saw or heard they hire expats? What if you saw or heard only French nationals work for AirFrance, what if Air France reported they had 1% expats? Inspired much?
I think it's perfectly acceptable to think the Tuskegee Airmen inspired black youth. Perfectly acceptable to think that if United's goals are achieved it will inspire girls and black youth.
The discusion of how to achieve that goal, or if it can be achieved is separate from who will be inspired.
If you needed a job, would you be inspired to work for Emirates if you saw or heard they hire expats? What if you saw or heard only French nationals work for AirFrance, what if Air France reported they had 1% expats? Inspired much?
04-12-2021, 12:27 PM
#515
Junior Senior
Joined APC: Feb 2012
Position: Whiskey Papa
Posts: 2,850
Originally Posted by Airhoss
I declare ooofff the winner. She has resorted to the extremely intellectual and impossible to beat debate technique of “I know you are, but what am I.” and “liar liar pants on fire.” . Now if she could say it in Pig Latin and have all of her mean girl friends back her up with eye rolls and talk to the hand gestures, she’d have put a nail in this thread’s coffin! At first I thought ooof was an stubborn, spoiled, child, who was used to getting whatever she wants, but now I see that she is truly a linguistic genius of untold proportions.
BTW, not all females think like Ooof!
04-12-2021, 12:43 PM
#516
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2016
Posts: 774
I apologize for butchering that.
You seemed offended at OOfff saying United's goals would inspire minority youth and young women. I also think United's goals would inspire minority youth and young women.
I referenced the Tuskegee Airmen as an example from the past where youth may have been inspired by pilots who looked like them.
Your post about Micheal Jordan and Tiger Woods made it appear that you disagree with OOfff about what inspires young people.
OOfff's post seemed to talk about inspiring people to work at United, and you jumped to racism and saying Micheal Jordan was your role model.
You seemed offended at OOfff saying United's goals would inspire minority youth and young women. I also think United's goals would inspire minority youth and young women.
I referenced the Tuskegee Airmen as an example from the past where youth may have been inspired by pilots who looked like them.
Your post about Micheal Jordan and Tiger Woods made it appear that you disagree with OOfff about what inspires young people.
OOfff's post seemed to talk about inspiring people to work at United, and you jumped to racism and saying Micheal Jordan was your role model.
Last edited by Happyflyer; 04-12-2021 at 01:09 PM.
04-13-2021, 03:51 PM
#517
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2005
Posts: 8,898
Originally Posted by OOfff
These are the words of someone who had role models that looked like them.
I just don't buy the argument that someone has to look my skin color in order for me to do their job. This is 2021, we should be beyond pettiness like this.
Another thing, in our culture pilots just aren't thought of being the rock stars that some might think they are. A pilot job doesn't technically require a degree, most know that, and in our culture this bias is established. It doesn't matter if you are making six figures flying Airbus or Boeing. An example, my degree is in engineering. My family and I were at a wedding and my father was introducing us kids to some other friends. When it came to my turn, he said here is my second son and he's, uh, his background is in engineering. And then moved on to the next son. In some cultures, showing you're educated is more important than telling someone you're just a pilot. Of course later in private I talked to my father and called him on it, that next time you should introduce me and then say what my job is, not my degree.
Growing up, both my parents were against me becoming an airline pilot. Father thought after 9/11 people that looked like us wouldn't be hired, mother thought it was too dangerous. The biggest obstacle I faced was never white men in aviation. It was family, people who looked like me, and convincing them that this IS what I want to do and that I do want to do it. In the end, father did support me and both parents are proud. But it took a lot of convincing, begging, etc.
Lastly as a minority, I do think the anger against white men, white privilege, all of it, needs to be toned down. I'm seeing the country be torn with these self-created (largely, media created) race divisions.
Last edited by ShyGuy; 04-13-2021 at 04:06 PM.
04-13-2021, 05:11 PM
#518
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2013
Posts: 4,672
Originally Posted by ShyGuy
I'm seeing the country be torn with these self-created (largely, media created combined with people too stupid to think for themselves) race divisions.
(filler)
04-13-2021, 08:03 PM
#519
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2014
Posts: 390
Originally Posted by ShyGuy
I don't buy this. I'm a minority immigrant to this country and growing up every time we flew as a kid, I always tried to stop at the end of the flight to see the flight deck. It was always white male men, and guess what, every single one was receptive and made me believe I could do it. When I told an Airtran crew I was a student pilot (later in my teens), they let me sit in the seat and program the FMS (of course told me what to push). I never needed to see a brown guy up there to know that I could do it.
I just don't buy the argument that someone has to look my skin color in order for me to do their job. This is 2021, we should be beyond pettiness like this.
Another thing, in our culture pilots just aren't thought of being the rock stars that some might think they are. A pilot job doesn't technically require a degree, most know that, and in our culture this bias is established. It doesn't matter if you are making six figures flying Airbus or Boeing. An example, my degree is in engineering. My family and I were at a wedding and my father was introducing us kids to some other friends. When it came to my turn, he said here is my second son and he's, uh, his background is in engineering. And then moved on to the next son. In some cultures, showing you're educated is more important than telling someone you're just a pilot. Of course later in private I talked to my father and called him on it, that next time you should introduce me and then say what my job is, not my degree.
Growing up, both my parents were against me becoming an airline pilot. Father thought after 9/11 people that looked like us wouldn't be hired, mother thought it was too dangerous. The biggest obstacle I faced was never white men in aviation. It was family, people who looked like me, and convincing them that this IS what I want to do and that I do want to do it. In the end, father did support me and both parents are proud. But it took a lot of convincing, begging, etc.
Lastly as a minority, I do think the anger against white men, white privilege, all of it, needs to be toned down. I'm seeing the country be torn with these self-created (largely, media created) race divisions.
I just don't buy the argument that someone has to look my skin color in order for me to do their job. This is 2021, we should be beyond pettiness like this.
Another thing, in our culture pilots just aren't thought of being the rock stars that some might think they are. A pilot job doesn't technically require a degree, most know that, and in our culture this bias is established. It doesn't matter if you are making six figures flying Airbus or Boeing. An example, my degree is in engineering. My family and I were at a wedding and my father was introducing us kids to some other friends. When it came to my turn, he said here is my second son and he's, uh, his background is in engineering. And then moved on to the next son. In some cultures, showing you're educated is more important than telling someone you're just a pilot. Of course later in private I talked to my father and called him on it, that next time you should introduce me and then say what my job is, not my degree.
Growing up, both my parents were against me becoming an airline pilot. Father thought after 9/11 people that looked like us wouldn't be hired, mother thought it was too dangerous. The biggest obstacle I faced was never white men in aviation. It was family, people who looked like me, and convincing them that this IS what I want to do and that I do want to do it. In the end, father did support me and both parents are proud. But it took a lot of convincing, begging, etc.
Lastly as a minority, I do think the anger against white men, white privilege, all of it, needs to be toned down. I'm seeing the country be torn with these self-created (largely, media created) race divisions.
04-13-2021, 10:53 PM
#520
On Reserve
Joined APC: Oct 2020
Posts: 18
Truth
Originally Posted by ShyGuy
I don't buy this. I'm a minority immigrant to this country and growing up every time we flew as a kid, I always tried to stop at the end of the flight to see the flight deck. It was always white male men, and guess what, every single one was receptive and made me believe I could do it. When I told an Airtran crew I was a student pilot (later in my teens), they let me sit in the seat and program the FMS (of course told me what to push). I never needed to see a brown guy up there to know that I could do it.
I just don't buy the argument that someone has to look my skin color in order for me to do their job. This is 2021, we should be beyond pettiness like this.
Another thing, in our culture pilots just aren't thought of being the rock stars that some might think they are. A pilot job doesn't technically require a degree, most know that, and in our culture this bias is established. It doesn't matter if you are making six figures flying Airbus or Boeing. An example, my degree is in engineering. My family and I were at a wedding and my father was introducing us kids to some other friends. When it came to my turn, he said here is my second son and he's, uh, his background is in engineering. And then moved on to the next son. In some cultures, showing you're educated is more important than telling someone you're just a pilot. Of course later in private I talked to my father and called him on it, that next time you should introduce me and then say what my job is, not my degree.
Growing up, both my parents were against me becoming an airline pilot. Father thought after 9/11 people that looked like us wouldn't be hired, mother thought it was too dangerous. The biggest obstacle I faced was never white men in aviation. It was family, people who looked like me, and convincing them that this IS what I want to do and that I do want to do it. In the end, father did support me and both parents are proud. But it took a lot of convincing, begging, etc.
Lastly as a minority, I do think the anger against white men, white privilege, all of it, needs to be toned down. I'm seeing the country be torn with these self-created (largely, media created) race divisions.
I just don't buy the argument that someone has to look my skin color in order for me to do their job. This is 2021, we should be beyond pettiness like this.
Another thing, in our culture pilots just aren't thought of being the rock stars that some might think they are. A pilot job doesn't technically require a degree, most know that, and in our culture this bias is established. It doesn't matter if you are making six figures flying Airbus or Boeing. An example, my degree is in engineering. My family and I were at a wedding and my father was introducing us kids to some other friends. When it came to my turn, he said here is my second son and he's, uh, his background is in engineering. And then moved on to the next son. In some cultures, showing you're educated is more important than telling someone you're just a pilot. Of course later in private I talked to my father and called him on it, that next time you should introduce me and then say what my job is, not my degree.
Growing up, both my parents were against me becoming an airline pilot. Father thought after 9/11 people that looked like us wouldn't be hired, mother thought it was too dangerous. The biggest obstacle I faced was never white men in aviation. It was family, people who looked like me, and convincing them that this IS what I want to do and that I do want to do it. In the end, father did support me and both parents are proud. But it took a lot of convincing, begging, etc.
Lastly as a minority, I do think the anger against white men, white privilege, all of it, needs to be toned down. I'm seeing the country be torn with these self-created (largely, media created) race divisions.
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