I am going to have to throw in with av8or. More than 2 decades at Alaska Airlines- every base, both seats, and every jet we have had and have now. The old collaborative gig harbor flying club is about gone and Amen for that. The legacy Airbus crowd have certainly raised their voices but the determined steadfast resolve of this union is 100% homegrown Alaska Airlines make no mistake about it. Brad Tilden and Co. don't like it at all but they have spent 20-30 years creating it and now they can reap what they have sown. The core philosophy that has driven Alaska management for all my years here is simple: Always take more than you give and after that let the Flight Ops bureaucrats take even more. Always paint a grim picture especially when times are good. Any chance you have to kick someone when they are down take it. Always have flashy slogans but never live up to them. Most of all never let up on the pressure to Divide and Conquer....OTZ, my brother, you can relax. Every pilot at this airline knew furloughs were coming when the Wuhani Flu turned into a worldwide bogeyman. Simple math can produce estimates. Most everyone here has been “punched in the mouth” before and the ones who haven’t are about to. Likely, in the end, most will get back up and be ok. Hate to tell ya bud bud the song you are singin don’t play here no more......

 

I appreciate everyones thoughts. The union has no control at this point, they are the six grade spelling champ, taking on the High School State wrestling champ. They can use great words up to a certain point but make no mistake about it, they are about to get their ass kicked. It will be public, it will be purposeful and the six grader will have zero control. There will be no showing the numbers, “no proving the furlough”, there will just be a giant furlough. I think a better relationship, a better tone, would have yielded significantly better results, but We said “No favors, No wavers, burn it to the dirt”, management is about to respond in kind. Maybe we would have arrived at this point no matter what, I really believe it’s the result of the #angry8, and #183/63. Maybe there is a great union victory ahead for us, many years from now. I have just never seen one of those, just a lot of rhetoric, a lot of talk. Many new faces, angry and vocal, promised to deliver such a victory, they said they had this. Seems maybe not as easy as they let on, maybe they are not as smart, not as capable as they so proudly once boasted.

 

Do you seriously think anyone is listening or cares, even a little, to/ about anything you have to say?

Go the eff away. For good this time.

 

His numbers will be accurate, but his intentions are clear:
#Divideandconquer
#notprounion
#mea/otzaremanagment
#ihatevxpilots

 

What has happened over the weekend to go from this to a giant furlough, you are now forecasting? Is it just getting back at the union as you discuss or something more concrete.

 

Well done my man. Nice. Slow. Boil..... so you could keep as many frogs in the pot as possible.

You’ve gone from “trying to be helpful” on here, to full on ”VXrs are the angry problem children, who ruined the union.”, “Union leadership is a bunch of lying morons.” “Management has tried so incredibly hard to play nice.” “Your union leaders are lying to you.” Etc etc etc.....

You didn’t answer a single point I made about how we got here.... just more “gonna be about 385, Union leadership are liars, SFO/LAX LEC’s screwed things up, Angry Vx’rs are the problem”......

“Maybe there’s a great union victory ahead for us.”

1. 385
2. Union leadership are weak liars
3. 800 angry VXrs caused the problem
4. Management is brilliant, good and virtuous
5. And since you’ve trusted in your stupid, childish, weak, incompetent, no integrity union leadership..... NOW you’re about to PAY!!!! Hell they might furlough more just cause they can.... to prove a point!

Whoever you are....YOU..... aren’t part of the “Us”. Oh well.... it was fun while it lasted.

 

But didn’t YOU, MANAGEMENT, buy your #angry8? You brought this on yourselves.

The pilots are now unified and a great group. It’s sad to see management have to come on here, and all you can do is attempt to be a bully.

We all know you make the decisions unilaterally, right or wrong. History at AS has proven just that, time and time again. Pretty sad to admit you’ll continue down that path again just to flex your “High School Wrestling” muscles just to prove your point.

Maybe some day, you can graduate from high school.

 

A better relationship goes both ways. The airline outgrew this management teams skill set. They still think that "being a family", and the other nonsense slogans will get us to work for less.

 

So I am an AA guy so please take my comments as bathroom reading material but after reading some of the post I am wondering what otz thinks any union is gonna be able to do about staffing decisions. I ask because in our case we still have 1300 surplus pilots after the APA and AA did an admirable job of mitigation. That said if AA decides to furlough us I fail to see how it would be the fault of the APA. Mitigation of no mitigation no union will be able to stop furloughs as staffing levels are completely the per-view of the company. Also I have never seen concessions that actually prevented furloughs. That said good luck to all AS pilots.

 

Nobody is looking to bring AS down. We're only asking for our fair share of the pie through improvements to our contract in line with industry norms.

If AS management finds our willingness to fight for that offensive, and chooses to kick a good bunch of us to the curb out of spite, then so be it, but I hope my AS brothers and sisters stay strong and united all the way to the end.