Allegiant Air
07-30-2015, 10:36 AM
#3421
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Joined APC: Oct 2010
Position: Airbus CA
Posts: 910
Originally Posted by 4andCounting
Can someone post content please?
I did read an AP report that included some statements from the company identifying & backing the pilots saying they weren't low on fuel & they are cooperating with the FAA.
FWIW
07-30-2015, 10:38 AM
#3422
Gets Tue/Wed and Sat Off
Joined APC: Oct 2008
Posts: 551
Googled it and this came up:
An unusual emergency landing by an Allegiant Travel Co. flight low on fuel is drawing new scrutiny to the budget carrier following a string of other in-flight disruptions.
The Federal Aviation Administration said it is gathering information about the incident, which occurred last week when two of the airline’s executives were flying an Allegiant jet carrying 150 people from Las Vegas to Fargo, N.D. The agency already had increased its oversight of the Las Vegas-based carrier because of a recent string of diversions and emergency landings.
The July 23 flight left Las Vegas despite a public notice from the FAA that the airspace around Fargo would be closed for practice by the U.S. Navy’s Blue Angels aerobatic jets. When the Allegiant jet arrived in Fargo, controllers told the pilots they would have to wait 20 minutes to land.
“Listen, we’re at [low] fuel in about probably three to four minutes,” the pilot responded, according to air-traffic-control recordings. “I’ve got to come in and land.” The jet landed without incident after controllers ordered the Blue Angels away from the airport.
Allegiant said late Wednesday that the flight was piloted by Greg Baden, its vice president of operations, and Michael Wuerger, director of flight safety, both of whom were flying to gather cockpit time to maintain their pilot certifications.
Allegiant said its dispatchers released the flight to Fargo because the FAA notice made it seem like the airport would remain open for passenger airlines. The carrier said the aircraft landed with 42 minutes of fuel remaining. The FAA requires airliners to have 45 minutes more fuel than what its scheduled route should require.
“Our captain exercised good fuel-management judgment,” Steve Harfst, Allegiant’s chief operating officer, said in an interview. “We have some work to do internally on flight planning and flight dispatching.”
The incident came as Allegiant has been embroiled for years in contentious contract negotiations with its pilots union, whose planned strike in April was halted by a federal judge. In recent months, the pilots union has publicly alleged the airline is cutting corners at the expense of safety. Pilots say “they are forced to fly aircraft that barely passes acceptable safety standards,” the union said in one report.
Mr. Harfst attributed the union’s allegations to bargaining tactics, and said they “are completely unfounded.”
From September to March, Allegiant had at least 65 incidents, including aborted takeoffs and diversions, because of maintenance-related issues on aircraft, according to the union. From June 8 to July 6, Allegiant had at least another 28 such incidents, the union said. Neither airlines nor the FAA make such data public, so it is difficult to compare the rate of incidents at Allegiant to its peers.
In one case in June, passengers climbed onto a jet’s wings via the emergency exits after it landed in Boise, Idaho, because a fuel leak was sending fumes into the cabin, according to the FAA.
Mr. Harfst didn’t dispute the union’s tally of recent incidents but added that this year’s number of disruptions is similar to past years.
“If we can’t run a safe airline, we shouldn’t be in the business,” he said. Allegiant has a relatively high number of diversions because it doesn’t have mechanics in most of its cities and often has to send flights back to its hubs when maintenance issues arise, he said. “That presents a unique challenge when it comes to customer service, but if anything, it’s an example of our focus on safety,” he said.
Allegiant is the ninth-largest U.S. airline, accounting for 1.5% of the 76 million domestic airline seats scheduled in July. The discount carrier’s strategy centers on using inexpensive, used jets to ferry vacationers between smaller cities and tourist hot spots, like Las Vegas and Orlando.
Allegiant has one of the industry’s highest profit margins, and on Wednesday it reported second-quarter profit increased 62% to $54.3 million from a year prior.
Air-safety experts said Thursday’s emergency in Fargo was extraordinary because dispatchers sent a plane into closed airspace and an aircraft ran short on fuel, something that should happen only in extreme circumstances.
“There are a lot of questions about this one,” said air-safety consultant John Cox, a former airline pilot. “With the number of incidents this year, increased scrutiny is understandable.”
An unusual emergency landing by an Allegiant Travel Co. flight low on fuel is drawing new scrutiny to the budget carrier following a string of other in-flight disruptions.
The Federal Aviation Administration said it is gathering information about the incident, which occurred last week when two of the airline’s executives were flying an Allegiant jet carrying 150 people from Las Vegas to Fargo, N.D. The agency already had increased its oversight of the Las Vegas-based carrier because of a recent string of diversions and emergency landings.
The July 23 flight left Las Vegas despite a public notice from the FAA that the airspace around Fargo would be closed for practice by the U.S. Navy’s Blue Angels aerobatic jets. When the Allegiant jet arrived in Fargo, controllers told the pilots they would have to wait 20 minutes to land.
“Listen, we’re at [low] fuel in about probably three to four minutes,” the pilot responded, according to air-traffic-control recordings. “I’ve got to come in and land.” The jet landed without incident after controllers ordered the Blue Angels away from the airport.
Allegiant said late Wednesday that the flight was piloted by Greg Baden, its vice president of operations, and Michael Wuerger, director of flight safety, both of whom were flying to gather cockpit time to maintain their pilot certifications.
Allegiant said its dispatchers released the flight to Fargo because the FAA notice made it seem like the airport would remain open for passenger airlines. The carrier said the aircraft landed with 42 minutes of fuel remaining. The FAA requires airliners to have 45 minutes more fuel than what its scheduled route should require.
“Our captain exercised good fuel-management judgment,” Steve Harfst, Allegiant’s chief operating officer, said in an interview. “We have some work to do internally on flight planning and flight dispatching.”
The incident came as Allegiant has been embroiled for years in contentious contract negotiations with its pilots union, whose planned strike in April was halted by a federal judge. In recent months, the pilots union has publicly alleged the airline is cutting corners at the expense of safety. Pilots say “they are forced to fly aircraft that barely passes acceptable safety standards,” the union said in one report.
Mr. Harfst attributed the union’s allegations to bargaining tactics, and said they “are completely unfounded.”
From September to March, Allegiant had at least 65 incidents, including aborted takeoffs and diversions, because of maintenance-related issues on aircraft, according to the union. From June 8 to July 6, Allegiant had at least another 28 such incidents, the union said. Neither airlines nor the FAA make such data public, so it is difficult to compare the rate of incidents at Allegiant to its peers.
In one case in June, passengers climbed onto a jet’s wings via the emergency exits after it landed in Boise, Idaho, because a fuel leak was sending fumes into the cabin, according to the FAA.
Mr. Harfst didn’t dispute the union’s tally of recent incidents but added that this year’s number of disruptions is similar to past years.
“If we can’t run a safe airline, we shouldn’t be in the business,” he said. Allegiant has a relatively high number of diversions because it doesn’t have mechanics in most of its cities and often has to send flights back to its hubs when maintenance issues arise, he said. “That presents a unique challenge when it comes to customer service, but if anything, it’s an example of our focus on safety,” he said.
Allegiant is the ninth-largest U.S. airline, accounting for 1.5% of the 76 million domestic airline seats scheduled in July. The discount carrier’s strategy centers on using inexpensive, used jets to ferry vacationers between smaller cities and tourist hot spots, like Las Vegas and Orlando.
Allegiant has one of the industry’s highest profit margins, and on Wednesday it reported second-quarter profit increased 62% to $54.3 million from a year prior.
Air-safety experts said Thursday’s emergency in Fargo was extraordinary because dispatchers sent a plane into closed airspace and an aircraft ran short on fuel, something that should happen only in extreme circumstances.
“There are a lot of questions about this one,” said air-safety consultant John Cox, a former airline pilot. “With the number of incidents this year, increased scrutiny is understandable.”
07-30-2015, 10:44 AM
#3423
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Joined APC: Feb 2007
Position: 1st year pay for the 3rd time
Posts: 1,434
The way that article reads it looks like a dispatcher is going to take the fall.
07-30-2015, 10:44 AM
#3424
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Joined APC: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,404
vhttp://www.staradvertiser.com/news/breaking/20150730_Allegiant_executives_were_flying_plane_th at_ran_low_on_fuel.html?id=320114301
07-30-2015, 10:45 AM
#3425
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2007
Position: 30 West
Posts: 417
Looks like it was your bosses.....
Allegiant executives were flying plane that ran low on fuel
Two executives with pilot licenses were flying the Allegiant Air jet that made an emergency landing at a closed airport because it nearly ran out of fuel.
Allegiant spokeswoman Jessica Wheeler said Thursday that management pilots routinely operate flights to maintain their pilot certification and track day-to-day operations.
Vice president of flight operations Greg Baden and director of flight safety Michael Wuerger were at the controls of the July 23 flight with 144 passengers on board, the airline said. The identity of the pilots was first reported by the Las Vegas Review-Journal.
The plane left Las Vegas more than an hour behind schedule, according to tracking service FlightAware.com. By the time it reached its intended destination of Fargo, North Dakota, that airport was temporarily closed so the Navy's Blue Angels flight team could practice for an air show.
According to a LiveATC.net recording, one of the pilots told an air traffic controller that he didn't have enough fuel to reach another airport and couldn't even wait 20 minutes — he would declare an emergency and land. Federal rules require airliners to carry enough fuel to reach their destination or an alternate airport with a reserve of 45 minutes worth of fuel. The plane landed safely in Fargo.
Wheeler said the pilot meant he had less than 20 minutes before dipping into the 45-minute reserve. She added that Allegiant believed that the Fargo closure included an exception for scheduled passenger flights. She said the company believes the executive did nothing wrong in their operation of the flight.
The Las Vegas-based airline, a unit of Allegiant Travel Co., said it is cooperating with investigators from the Federal Aviation Administration.
Allegiant executives were flying plane that ran low on fuel
Two executives with pilot licenses were flying the Allegiant Air jet that made an emergency landing at a closed airport because it nearly ran out of fuel.
Allegiant spokeswoman Jessica Wheeler said Thursday that management pilots routinely operate flights to maintain their pilot certification and track day-to-day operations.
Vice president of flight operations Greg Baden and director of flight safety Michael Wuerger were at the controls of the July 23 flight with 144 passengers on board, the airline said. The identity of the pilots was first reported by the Las Vegas Review-Journal.
The plane left Las Vegas more than an hour behind schedule, according to tracking service FlightAware.com. By the time it reached its intended destination of Fargo, North Dakota, that airport was temporarily closed so the Navy's Blue Angels flight team could practice for an air show.
According to a LiveATC.net recording, one of the pilots told an air traffic controller that he didn't have enough fuel to reach another airport and couldn't even wait 20 minutes — he would declare an emergency and land. Federal rules require airliners to carry enough fuel to reach their destination or an alternate airport with a reserve of 45 minutes worth of fuel. The plane landed safely in Fargo.
Wheeler said the pilot meant he had less than 20 minutes before dipping into the 45-minute reserve. She added that Allegiant believed that the Fargo closure included an exception for scheduled passenger flights. She said the company believes the executive did nothing wrong in their operation of the flight.
The Las Vegas-based airline, a unit of Allegiant Travel Co., said it is cooperating with investigators from the Federal Aviation Administration.
07-30-2015, 10:45 AM
#3426
Gets Tue/Wed and Sat Off
Joined APC: Oct 2008
Posts: 551
Originally Posted by The Chow
The way that article reads it looks like a dispatcher is going to take the fall.
07-30-2015, 11:09 AM
#3427
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Joined APC: May 2007
Position: A320 Captain
Posts: 1,982
Does Allegiant fly under 121 rules or 121 Supplemental?
07-30-2015, 11:46 AM
#3428
Line Holder
Joined APC: Jun 2015
Posts: 74
Originally Posted by pilotgolfer
Does Allegiant fly under 121 rules or 121 Supplemental?
07-30-2015, 12:00 PM
#3429
Line Holder
Joined APC: Aug 2013
Position: 737 FO
Posts: 39
According to a LiveATC.net recording, one of the pilots told an air traffic controller that he didn't have enough fuel to reach another airport and couldn't even wait 20 minutes — he would declare an emergency and land. Federal rules require airliners to carry enough fuel to reach their destination or an alternate airport with a reserve of 45 minutes worth of fuel. The plane landed safely in Fargo.
Allegiant spokeswoman Jessica Wheeler said the pilot meant he had less than 20 minutes before dipping into the 45-minute reserve. She added that Allegiant believed that the Fargo closure included an exception for scheduled passenger flights. She said the company believes the executive did nothing wrong in their operation of the flight.
Allegiant spokeswoman Jessica Wheeler said the pilot meant he had less than 20 minutes before dipping into the 45-minute reserve. She added that Allegiant believed that the Fargo closure included an exception for scheduled passenger flights. She said the company believes the executive did nothing wrong in their operation of the flight.
If the field is closed, and you have enough fuel to reach alternate (according to Wheeler), why not proceed to alternate?
Even if they "think" the NOTAM did not apply to their flight, and ATC is telling you go elsewhere, then it makes no sense to declare an emergency if fuel was not a factor.
If they blame dispatch, wouldn't that be admitting the NOTAM was clear about the airport being temporarily closed that day?
Sorry you guys flying at Allegiant have this kind of leadership.
07-30-2015, 12:23 PM
#3430
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Joined APC: Jul 2015
Posts: 61
"Mr. Harfst didn’t dispute the union’s tally of recent incidents but added that this year’s number of disruptions is similar to past years."
Holy crap!! And to think GREG actually told the PIE Captain that he fired that he "brought embarrassment to the company because of the media attention"!!
Isn't Harfst kinda saying, "sure we suck, but no more than previous years"?!?!
Why do they keep letting these guys make these idiotic statements?
Holy crap!! And to think GREG actually told the PIE Captain that he fired that he "brought embarrassment to the company because of the media attention"!!
Isn't Harfst kinda saying, "sure we suck, but no more than previous years"?!?!
Why do they keep letting these guys make these idiotic statements?
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