Numbers
01-06-2020, 05:27 PM
#31
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,889
Originally Posted by Al Czervik
The TPS is one of the most misunderstood things in the cockpit. I can’t tell you how many times we have needed new numbers and the other guy insisted we didn’t/times we didn’t need new numbers and they insisted we did. A overhaul wouldn’t hurt. It’s a powerful tool but needs a dummy interface. I think it will be 100% uplinked in the future. Uplink=valid
So maybe they’re just not training it the way they used to. Once you understand the TPS it’s a piece of cake. I think what you mean to say is, they need to teach it better.
01-07-2020, 03:00 AM
#32
You scratched my anchor
Joined APC: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,876
Originally Posted by aa73
Well that’s a fair point, but if someone didn’t understand the TPS during an actual flight, that’s not the fault of the TPS - it’s the CKA’s and pilot’s fault for not fully training it/understanding it before being released to the line. When I checked out as a brand new 727 F/E back in 2000, our CKAs made sure we know that thing COLD, inside and out. There was zero confusion from day 1.
So maybe they’re just not training it the way they used to. Once you understand the TPS it’s a piece of cake. I think what you mean to say is, they need to teach it better.
So maybe they’re just not training it the way they used to. Once you understand the TPS it’s a piece of cake. I think what you mean to say is, they need to teach it better.
01-07-2020, 05:26 AM
#33
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2010
Position: HUD cripple.
Posts: 312
Originally Posted by Al Czervik
Its possible the misunderstanding may go hand in hand with the lack of SOP on the 737.
Where do you get a "lack of SOP" on the 737? It's just as standard as every other fleet. And if it's some kind of 737 issue, we shouldn't have had another airbus depart without any takeoff data set, or a valid TPS recently.
I'm with aa73, any lack of understanding of the TPS is a training issue.
Back to the question that started this whole circus, I'd say any time an airplane is "waiting for numbers", it's probably because they haven't received a load close out yet, not a TPS.
01-07-2020, 06:07 AM
#34
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,889
Originally Posted by Al Czervik
Its possible the misunderstanding may go hand in hand with the lack of SOP on the 737.
I’ve got close to 5000hrs on the 737 fleet and you couldn’t be more wrong. We are just as standard as any other fleet
Al you’re losing your credibility with these types of sweeping generalizations.
01-07-2020, 07:06 AM
#35
You scratched my anchor
Joined APC: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,876
Originally Posted by aa73
Is this a serious question? Are you a 737 CKA, or fleet manager, line pilot..... or even anyone qualified to make this type of statement?
I’ve got close to 5000hrs on the 737 fleet and you couldn’t be more wrong. We are just as standard as any other fleet
Al you’re losing your credibility with these types of sweeping generalizations.
I’ve got close to 5000hrs on the 737 fleet and you couldn’t be more wrong. We are just as standard as any other fleet
Al you’re losing your credibility with these types of sweeping generalizations.
When is the before takeoff checklist completed?
What is the response to a checklist item?
What happens to the checklist when the hud is not set?
Who briefs the takeoff?
Who starts the apu after landing?
When is the before landing checklist completed?
What is the call climbing or descending through 18,0
Are these things uptight? Yes. Are they standard? No.
After 5,000 hours I can understand you thinking it’s SOP. You don’t get to see how different things are done on a day to day basis from the left seat. It’s standardized deviance. Things I used to notice (because they are not done standard) just slide by now that I have 2,000 hours on it. Are these things unsafe? Not really. Maybe I’m use to a more standard cockpit, but it’s not SOP.
01-07-2020, 07:51 AM
#37
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2014
Posts: 569
Originally Posted by Al Czervik
A few of the things:
When is the before takeoff checklist completed?
What is the response to a checklist item?
What happens to the checklist when the hud is not set?
Who briefs the takeoff?
Who starts the apu after landing?
When is the before landing checklist completed?
What is the call climbing or descending through 18,0
Are these things uptight? Yes. Are they standard? No.
After 5,000 hours I can understand you thinking it’s SOP. You don’t get to see how different things are done on a day to day basis from the left seat. It’s standardized deviance. Things I used to notice (because they are not done standard) just slide by now that I have 2,000 hours on it. Are these things unsafe? Not really. Maybe I’m use to a more standard cockpit, but it’s not SOP.
When is the before takeoff checklist completed?
What is the response to a checklist item?
What happens to the checklist when the hud is not set?
Who briefs the takeoff?
Who starts the apu after landing?
When is the before landing checklist completed?
What is the call climbing or descending through 18,0
Are these things uptight? Yes. Are they standard? No.
After 5,000 hours I can understand you thinking it’s SOP. You don’t get to see how different things are done on a day to day basis from the left seat. It’s standardized deviance. Things I used to notice (because they are not done standard) just slide by now that I have 2,000 hours on it. Are these things unsafe? Not really. Maybe I’m use to a more standard cockpit, but it’s not SOP.
01-07-2020, 08:45 AM
#38
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,889
Originally Posted by Al Czervik
A few of the things:
When is the before takeoff checklist completed?
What is the response to a checklist item?
What happens to the checklist when the hud is not set?
Who briefs the takeoff?
Who starts the apu after landing?
When is the before landing checklist completed?
What is the call climbing or descending through 18,0
Are these things uptight? Yes. Are they standard? No.
After 5,000 hours I can understand you thinking it’s SOP. You don’t get to see how different things are done on a day to day basis from the left seat. It’s standardized deviance. Things I used to notice (because they are not done standard) just slide by now that I have 2,000 hours on it. Are these things unsafe? Not really. Maybe I’m use to a more standard cockpit, but it’s not SOP.
When is the before takeoff checklist completed?
What is the response to a checklist item?
What happens to the checklist when the hud is not set?
Who briefs the takeoff?
Who starts the apu after landing?
When is the before landing checklist completed?
What is the call climbing or descending through 18,0
Are these things uptight? Yes. Are they standard? No.
After 5,000 hours I can understand you thinking it’s SOP. You don’t get to see how different things are done on a day to day basis from the left seat. It’s standardized deviance. Things I used to notice (because they are not done standard) just slide by now that I have 2,000 hours on it. Are these things unsafe? Not really. Maybe I’m use to a more standard cockpit, but it’s not SOP.
Stop digging yourself a bigger hole, dude. You have ZERO credibility. You have absolutely no clue about 737 SOPs, but that’s exactly what they are - SOPs. You just challenge them because they are not the way YOU like to operate, as proven by your general anti 737 and anti LAA comments in the past. Do us all a favor and stick to your Airbus, I’m sure that fleet can benefit from your extensive knowledge base.
01-07-2020, 10:11 AM
#40
You scratched my anchor
Joined APC: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,876
Originally Posted by 450knotOffice
I believe Al was posting rhetorical questions, actually, to illustrate that apparently some of the pilots he flies with don't seem to know the answers to many, if not all of these questions.
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