Furlough Estimates
08-01-2020, 04:31 AM
#671
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2014
Posts: 1,297
Originally Posted by MikeTang
I agree. I lived in Italy for two years. Great place to visit, but would never live in Europe again. The scenery was amazing, but everything else was a disaster.
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Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk
Spent several hours in the Venice airport with my wife returning from our honeymoon. What a filthy dump. Carpets were all stained. Trash everywhere. If that's considered superior to the United States I must only go to the nicest of places in the US.
Frankly, I would describe most of Europe as dirty.
Cleanest urban areas I've been to were in Canada. US second.
08-01-2020, 04:55 AM
#672
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2016
Posts: 2,465
Originally Posted by NotMrNiceGuy
10X? Wow. That sounds like a lot.
The only people that think that superficial view of Europe vs. the US are doing so through their convenient political lens. Look, I love Europe. Fantastic locations, history, and scenery. There may even be a case that QOL there if you make less than $45K/€/£. But above that threshold, it’s not even close.
Tech:
US - Google, Facebook, Twitter, Uber, Netflix, Amazon, Apple, etc.
Europe - Nokia?
Education:
US - 7 out of top 10 universities in the world. Other three in the UK.
Transportation:
I’m guessing you like the train system? It’s true, many major EURO cities have great subway systems and city infrastructure. But beyond that, the trains were unreliable and not punctual. Plan an extra 45 minutes for everything (German/Italy) experience.
Welfare/Social Programs:
This is where it’s political. If that’s what you like, then it’s probably some kind of Utopia to you. But in Germany, those folks pay between 7-8% of gross for that healthcare. The UK is no different. Denmark is off the charts. Not to mention employer contribution of the same percentage. That’s more than three times what comes out of my paycheck. And the actual care? My wife had a baby here and abroad. The level of care is not the same. She said she felt like she was at a five star resort having the baby here in the US. No sharing rooms with other patients. Own bathroom. Meals that consisted of more than just bread and cheese.
Europe is definitely first world and is really nice. But nowadays, Americans tend to forget why their ancestors came here. Until you actually experience it, I think that European mystique is more hype than substance. It’s just annoying to hear over and over how incredible Europe is by those that just repeat talking points and have never spent any meaningful time there.
The only people that think that superficial view of Europe vs. the US are doing so through their convenient political lens. Look, I love Europe. Fantastic locations, history, and scenery. There may even be a case that QOL there if you make less than $45K/€/£. But above that threshold, it’s not even close.
Tech:
US - Google, Facebook, Twitter, Uber, Netflix, Amazon, Apple, etc.
Europe - Nokia?
Education:
US - 7 out of top 10 universities in the world. Other three in the UK.
Transportation:
I’m guessing you like the train system? It’s true, many major EURO cities have great subway systems and city infrastructure. But beyond that, the trains were unreliable and not punctual. Plan an extra 45 minutes for everything (German/Italy) experience.
Welfare/Social Programs:
This is where it’s political. If that’s what you like, then it’s probably some kind of Utopia to you. But in Germany, those folks pay between 7-8% of gross for that healthcare. The UK is no different. Denmark is off the charts. Not to mention employer contribution of the same percentage. That’s more than three times what comes out of my paycheck. And the actual care? My wife had a baby here and abroad. The level of care is not the same. She said she felt like she was at a five star resort having the baby here in the US. No sharing rooms with other patients. Own bathroom. Meals that consisted of more than just bread and cheese.
Europe is definitely first world and is really nice. But nowadays, Americans tend to forget why their ancestors came here. Until you actually experience it, I think that European mystique is more hype than substance. It’s just annoying to hear over and over how incredible Europe is by those that just repeat talking points and have never spent any meaningful time there.
08-01-2020, 05:22 AM
#673
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2020
Posts: 484
Originally Posted by FlyyGuyy
Spent several hours in the Venice airport with my wife returning from our honeymoon. What a filthy dump. Carpets were all stained. Trash everywhere. If that's considered superior to the United States I must only go to the nicest of places in the US.
Frankly, I would describe most of Europe as dirty.
Cleanest urban areas I've been to were in Canada. US second.
Frankly, I would describe most of Europe as dirty.
Cleanest urban areas I've been to were in Canada. US second.
Yeah Canada wins for cleanest cities you could almost eat off the ground in YYZ and YVR. I really miss the YVR overnight.
08-01-2020, 06:18 AM
#674
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2016
Posts: 774
Originally Posted by Da40Pilot
Hilarious. Did you just compare the US to France and called the US “more developed”?? You have got to be kidding me. Literally every country in Western Europe is at least 10x more developed than the US in terms of technology, education, transportation and welfare/social programs. And that 2 million figure you talk about was how many would die without govt doing anything about it (a hypothetical).
I posted a comment about France because that's where they are at right now.
130 Euros is $165. Should Trump impose that, the Governor, the Mayor, county sheriff, city police chief, National Guard commander, CDC director?
And btw the US GDP is 20T your claim about 10x higher is absurd Europe has a 200 Trillion GDP?
Typical Europe comparison pick one country and compare to entire US, how many times do we get to cherry pick a single state and compare it to the content of Europe. If that doesn't work kick out all of east Europe that's dragging the stats down and have only been free for 30 years now.
Last edited by Happyflyer; 08-01-2020 at 06:42 AM.
08-01-2020, 06:22 AM
#675
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2013
Posts: 1,764
Originally Posted by NotMrNiceGuy
10X? Wow. That sounds like a lot.
The only people that think that superficial view of Europe vs. the US are doing so through their convenient political lens. Look, I love Europe. Fantastic locations, history, and scenery. There may even be a case that QOL there if you make less than $45K/€/£. But above that threshold, it’s not even close.
Tech:
US - Google, Facebook, Twitter, Uber, Netflix, Amazon, Apple, etc.
Europe - Nokia?
Education:
US - 7 out of top 10 universities in the world. Other three in the UK.
Transportation:
I’m guessing you like the train system? It’s true, many major EURO cities have great subway systems and city infrastructure. But beyond that, the trains were unreliable and not punctual. Plan an extra 45 minutes for everything (German/Italy) experience.
Welfare/Social Programs:
This is where it’s political. If that’s what you like, then it’s probably some kind of Utopia to you. But in Germany, those folks pay between 7-8% of gross for that healthcare. The UK is no different. Denmark is off the charts. Not to mention employer contribution of the same percentage. That’s more than three times what comes out of my paycheck. And the actual care? My wife had a baby here and abroad. The level of care is not the same. She said she felt like she was at a five star resort having the baby here in the US. No sharing rooms with other patients. Own bathroom. Meals that consisted of more than just bread and cheese.
Europe is definitely first world and is really nice. But nowadays, Americans tend to forget why their ancestors came here. Until you actually experience it, I think that European mystique is more hype than substance. It’s just annoying to hear over and over how incredible Europe is by those that just repeat talking points and have never spent any meaningful time there.
The only people that think that superficial view of Europe vs. the US are doing so through their convenient political lens. Look, I love Europe. Fantastic locations, history, and scenery. There may even be a case that QOL there if you make less than $45K/€/£. But above that threshold, it’s not even close.
Tech:
US - Google, Facebook, Twitter, Uber, Netflix, Amazon, Apple, etc.
Europe - Nokia?
Education:
US - 7 out of top 10 universities in the world. Other three in the UK.
Transportation:
I’m guessing you like the train system? It’s true, many major EURO cities have great subway systems and city infrastructure. But beyond that, the trains were unreliable and not punctual. Plan an extra 45 minutes for everything (German/Italy) experience.
Welfare/Social Programs:
This is where it’s political. If that’s what you like, then it’s probably some kind of Utopia to you. But in Germany, those folks pay between 7-8% of gross for that healthcare. The UK is no different. Denmark is off the charts. Not to mention employer contribution of the same percentage. That’s more than three times what comes out of my paycheck. And the actual care? My wife had a baby here and abroad. The level of care is not the same. She said she felt like she was at a five star resort having the baby here in the US. No sharing rooms with other patients. Own bathroom. Meals that consisted of more than just bread and cheese.
Europe is definitely first world and is really nice. But nowadays, Americans tend to forget why their ancestors came here. Until you actually experience it, I think that European mystique is more hype than substance. It’s just annoying to hear over and over how incredible Europe is by those that just repeat talking points and have never spent any meaningful time there.
Who really cares if big tech or any tech comes from the US right now? If you wanna buy a fancy iphone, you still have to fork over a grand. Patriotic or nationalistic pride is not gonna get you any discount. Do Bavarians get a discount if they buy a Beamer? If I had time, I could list all those items where Europe is in the lead. Then again, dick bank level.
Education: Your university comparison only reflects to a tiny percentage of people in the US. And what is the “top“ based on? Who made those comparisons and based on what? The US universities are quite arrogant in rejecting any foreign university degrees and brag about being top in the world. The broad picture is different, ask people who went to school or university in Europe and the US.
Transportation: Have you had the opportunity to be stuck on I-95 or I-10 for several hours or any other major road? It sucks! At least there's an alternative in Europe by using rail. If you complain about the German railway, that's because the government has privatized the rail system. Service went south, prices up and yet over 65% of infrastructure funds went to highways. The result is a constant mess, late trains, parking lots on many Autobahns, especially in the Rhein-Ruhr/NRW area.
Healthcare: Incomplete picture of what you described. In Germany, there's a difference between Kassenpatient or Privatpatient, roughly translated as standard vs private. Many middle class citizens are privately insured and they do get their own bed in the hospital if they are “fortunate“ enough to having to go there. In the US I had to pay over $5000 for the birth of my son (with our AA health insurance), another $1500 when he had a mosquito bite close to his eye and he was sent to the ER. A friend of mine who wasn't feeling well, was told he had the flu while he visited us in Texas. We went to several docs and were prescribed crap. He returned to evil Europe and was sent straight to the ER – Guillain – Barre syndrome. Docs were scratching their heads how this was missed.
Why did Europeans come here? Wars, famine, religious prosecutions etc.
I could continue on and on. One thing to note is that regional differences play an important role.
A Brit that spent 25+ years in SoCal told me that living in the US with the same quality from Western Europe with regards to education, healthcare etc. has a very high price tag.
I spent time in both continents, well over a decade in each. There are two sides or more to every story or comparison. I love the US and Europe for many reasons and I dislike the US and Europe for many reasons. The good news is the my dislike applies mostly to people and I found plenty of anti-social things to do.
Last edited by Arado 234; 08-01-2020 at 06:41 AM.
08-01-2020, 06:33 AM
#676
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2013
Posts: 1,764
Originally Posted by Happyflyer
It will cost you 130 Euros in France if caught not wearing a mask.
Of course it spreads easier through a more developed country like USA. Why don't you go check out, Western Sahara and Mongolia and see what they know.
Trump has done as good a job as anyone. In March CNN said US would have over 2 million fatalities if it spread here like in Italy. Where are the other 1.9 million deaths?
No one will get on TV and saw 1-200k deaths is good news, but CNN specifically said 2 Million, so by my count Trump saved 1.8-1.9M people so far.
Of course it spreads easier through a more developed country like USA. Why don't you go check out, Western Sahara and Mongolia and see what they know.
Trump has done as good a job as anyone. In March CNN said US would have over 2 million fatalities if it spread here like in Italy. Where are the other 1.9 million deaths?
No one will get on TV and saw 1-200k deaths is good news, but CNN specifically said 2 Million, so by my count Trump saved 1.8-1.9M people so far.
Maybe you compared Trump to Bolsenaro or Lopez Obrador. That would be a tie.
08-01-2020, 08:16 AM
#677
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2010
Position: 787 FO
Posts: 253
I lived in europe for 4 years. Spent a lot of time in Venice particularly. Unless there was a garbage strike, the cleanliness was on par or better than big cities in the US. We had one 2 week garbage strike in all that time.
08-01-2020, 08:25 AM
#678
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2016
Posts: 774
Originally Posted by Arado 234
Really, Trump has done a good job compared to other leaders? Let's start with defunding the CDC, or calling the crisis a liberal hoax to bring him down. Oh, and btw un-do everything that Obama has done.
Maybe you compared Trump to Bolsenaro or Lopez Obrador. That would be a tie.
Maybe you compared Trump to Bolsenaro or Lopez Obrador. That would be a tie.
If your upset with the specific death rate of a state you'd have to look at that governor and see where Trump didn't support them to fault him.
NY governor requested 40k respirators, and Feds only had 9k in inventory, and they never used all of them. So advertising a 31k respirator shortage is misleading if you want but didnt use them all.
Were Americans really being intubated in hallways and parking lots? It was reported that would happen and occurred in China.
To my knowledge America flatted the curve and didn't intubate and let people die in makeshift hospitals and high school gyms.
To make Trump a failure we have to go back change our original expectations.
Last edited by Happyflyer; 08-01-2020 at 08:37 AM.
08-01-2020, 08:43 AM
#679
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2016
Posts: 774
Originally Posted by Da40Pilot
Hilarious. Did you just compare the US to France and called the US “more developed”?? You have got to be kidding me. Literally every country in Western Europe is at least 10x more developed than the US in terms of technology, education, transportation and welfare/social programs. And that 2 million figure you talk about was how many would die without govt doing anything about it (a hypothetical).
So when did CNN report that Trump engaged and prevented the 2 million number from happening.
At some point everyone thought this was a China problem just like H1N1, SARS, Swine, etc.
So complete failure number was 2 million deaths, and Trump is/was a complete failure at 150k deaths?
No one is gonna say 150 is below par because it's insensitive.
Did IKE botch WW2 because we had 400k deaths instead of 300k or 0? Why can't we just change our expectations after the event to judge him.
Last edited by Happyflyer; 08-01-2020 at 09:04 AM.
08-01-2020, 10:06 AM
#680
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2016
Posts: 6,716
Originally Posted by Happyflyer
So when did CNN report that Trump engaged and prevented the 2 million number from happening.
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