Overlander

Hey TP, hope the metro is still treating you well. But no, a bad move from management at a place does not indicate a picture of total working conditions. So far as I can tell Omni still outclasses WGA by a mile. Training isn’t even a comparison Omni was significantly better in many ways. And, while I appreciated your input back in turboprop days, you were wrong about myself and others when you called us “morons for thinking we could move directly into heavy type jets” since a lot of us did that successfully and enjoy our careers now.

We were told by management that they were being given pay while they looked for new jobs and had first right of refusal to come back. I don’t know how accurate that is. Still not a good look for them to do that.

Cujo665

"rights" as in CBA no.... will be first called and offered when hiring resumes, yes.

In this market I'd be surprised if all of them aren't at United, Delta or AA instead by now.

We were one of the best ACMI's around. We've fallen so far behind CBA wise that even AmeriJet is better compensated these days.
In general I really like the company, and the type of work we do, and who we do it for, but that doesn't put food on the table or pay the kids education bills.
I still really enjoy the job, but it really blows watching everybody else making bank while they play Ford & Harrison BS games and bring in federal mediators.
It's still a good place to work, it's just not in the top half anymore. If you've got time in already the golden handcuffs are on; if not... go elsewhere.

captjns

Do your research. Ask those who’ve been furloughed from their first day of BI to the day of their rating rides. Better yet… start a new thread.

Monkeywizz

There is a difference between being furloughed and fired. Omni/ATSG fired the pilots. BIG difference.

JohnBurke

If they were still drawing training wage at home, were they fired?

If they were brought back with the new class coming up, those that chose to come back, were they fired?

If they were kept on training wage, and told they'd have first choice of the next 767 or 777 opening, were they fired?

I've attended training and just prior to completion, have been sent home due to a change in the program. When that happened to me, I was offered no compensation, no ongoing wage, no promise of return, and not offered a different aircraft.

Are you saying that Omni didn't keep these guys on their training wage, didn't offer them openings with other ATSG companies flying the same type, didn't offer them the first opening in either a 767 or 777, and hasn't brought those back who wanted to return, with the upcoming June class? Is all that untrue?

There's no question that to let a class go hours before their checkride is low-class, and a ****-poor business decision, but then didn't the man who make that decision admit as much? Didn't he say he knew it was a bad choice, and he knew it would hurt the company, but that it was his decision and that he was going to do it anyway? Or is that untrue, too?

Monkeywizz

Yeah my spouse smacks me around. They buy me flowers and chocolate and apologize so all is forgiven.

JohnBurke

We may actually be married to the same woman. Except for the chocolate and flowers. Once in a while she tosses me an ice pack, though.

Guard

Atlas gives full pay and employee rights under contract (still probation one year) from day one as do all the majors. Atlas sends many classes home for 4-6 weeks in training do to sim availability usually after the oral but you know your coming back. This was pretty low and I hope Union is looking at getting "training pay" removed and make employees fir st day, seems like industry standard now. Even Nicholas Air is doing this with no Union.

JohnBurke

This wasn't Atlas, was it?

What does Air France do? Aeroflot? Air Canada? Doug's Props & Mops?

What's the Omni policy? Contractor until the checkride?

You're saying that Atlas might send an employee home during sim unavailability, keep paying them, and then bring them back? Hasn't Omni regularly done the same thing?

This wasn't a case of simulator unavailability, was it? What Atlas does during sim unavailability is therefore irrelevant, isn't it? Especially given that the operation under discussion isn't Atlas?

Some operations start employees at full pay on day one of training, others have a training wage; I can attest to having been put on a training wage for two months by several operators in the past, and in modern times, several still do. So, not without precedent. I don't know what Kalitta does now, but they used to put people on a 1,000 dollar training stipend and the employees had to get their own hotel.

In the case under discussion, Omni didn't send the training classes home because of simulator availability, but instead cancelled the classes, meaning that the contract pilots had no obligation owed from the company under the policy under which they were brought on board. Not even probationary pilots until after their checkride. Knowing that, Omni simply cut the classes, even two hours before the checkride, causing those who had given up their jobs, and taken a training wage without benefits for two months of day and night study at a hundred dollar a day stipend, to walk away empty -handed, without so much as a type rating for their effort. But here's where the discussion seems to take on a life of falsehoods.

They weren't really cut loose completely; they were retained on a training wage and told they'd be first in line for whatever class became available; short course to a checkride on the 767, or a 777 slot if that happened. Because Omni is owned by a company that has two other 767 operations, those in the cancelled classes were also told they'd have the option of going to those other companies (ATI, ABX), correct? Having been retained on the training wage, even though class cancelled and not simply sent home for sim availability, they were receiving that wage while they waited to either come back or while they hired on elsewhere, correct? Not that it's at all relevant, but if Atlas were to cancel a class, would they continue paying a daily sum to those no longer in the class?

Is it true that Omni has a class coming up and that all those from the cancelled class(es) were offered a return, with some accepting?

I'm not disputing the disgust that many express over the way this event was handled, but I am asking about clarification regarding some of the murkiness in the comments here; are these things correct, or not? For some who may be looking at Omni, knowing the truth may be of interest and important in making their own decisions.

I once knew a man who took up quick-draw shooting with a single action revolver, old-west style. Last I spoke to him, he'd shot himself in the foot three times. By some general tack, I've spoken with a number of pilots in the last month or two who have made reference to Omni as a place that pulls the rug out from under trainees, and a place to be avoided as both a destination, or as a stepping stone. One might say that Omni has shot itself in the foot, as metaphors go. Just because Omni can does not mean that Omni should.

I understand that better circumstance might be negotiated with a future contract, but was this class cancellation done under a future contract? If not, what might be isn't so much relevant, as what is. Therein lay my questions: what's the truth here?

Guard

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