MEC Early Out Comm
05-13-2020, 07:56 AM
#81
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2015
Position: Gramercy Riffs
Posts: 496
Originally Posted by 80ktsClamp
Wait, but the company has chosen the blame game with the infamous Ed memo that shamed us against the other employee groups for not taking unpaid leaves and other measures.
Did you willfully ignore that?
Did you willfully ignore that?
I may or may not have read this ‘infamous, shaming’ memo. If I did I have forgotten the tone. Could you please either post it here or provide a link so I may read it and form an opinion and reply? I don’t want to be accused (again) of being ‘willfully ignorant’.
05-13-2020, 08:06 AM
#82
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2015
Position: A350 Both
Posts: 7,292
Originally Posted by sailingfun
The NWA plan is frozen and the value does not increase with age. That is why they felt in the SLI negotiations that most NWA pilots would retire at 60.
Let's see... I am at the top of the food chain. I can 'retire' and start collecting my frozen benefit... or.... continue 'working' 9 - 12 days/month for half the year (call in sick and use my vacation in the other half) stay insured and make well over $200K/year to boot. The lawyer that tried to sell that had to have practiced in a mirror because there is no way he could say that one time with a straight face.
05-13-2020, 08:11 AM
#83
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2015
Position: A350 Both
Posts: 7,292
Originally Posted by beernutt
Because, in my opinion, the company has chosen not to play the blame game. DALPA seems more than willing to publicly blame the lack of progress on the company. Noise, no results. In my experience, the kid that cries the most to the parents after a fight with their brother is usually the one with the most to hide.
Speaking of results, the word ‘progress’ was used a few times, not by me, but attributed to me. I like the word ‘results’ more. Results are quantifiable, progress is subjective.
Thanks for the civil debate. Like I said, I respect your opinion.
btw, did you ever live in Moab?
Speaking of results, the word ‘progress’ was used a few times, not by me, but attributed to me. I like the word ‘results’ more. Results are quantifiable, progress is subjective.
Thanks for the civil debate. Like I said, I respect your opinion.
btw, did you ever live in Moab?
05-13-2020, 08:15 AM
#84
veut gagner à la loterie
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: Light Chop
Posts: 23,286
Originally Posted by Hank Kingsley
So you are going to be furloughed? Or displaced and retire because you can't hack a school. Which one?
05-13-2020, 08:19 AM
#85
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2015
Position: Gramercy Riffs
Posts: 496
Originally Posted by gloopy
You blame the MEC, deflect on the blame for Ed and/or the team directly under his command, then posit this theory?
This isn't anywhere near similar to the VB situation where they sat on it way past the agreed upon timeline, promised to discuss their plans with us, then suddenly and overnight sandbagged us with something different "just because they could" so we finally had enough and pulled it down. So now you think because of that, they fake negotiated something that would have saved them a ton of money, cost any participating pilots some money, then pulled it down immediately, well within the timeline agreed upon, out of some semblance of spite, where the only cost to either party was to them by reducing prescious cash reserves by tens of millions, perhaps hundreds of millions assuming a broader application and participation?
Is that about right? And so because of all that, what exactly would you propose we do from PPOS?
This isn't anywhere near similar to the VB situation where they sat on it way past the agreed upon timeline, promised to discuss their plans with us, then suddenly and overnight sandbagged us with something different "just because they could" so we finally had enough and pulled it down. So now you think because of that, they fake negotiated something that would have saved them a ton of money, cost any participating pilots some money, then pulled it down immediately, well within the timeline agreed upon, out of some semblance of spite, where the only cost to either party was to them by reducing prescious cash reserves by tens of millions, perhaps hundreds of millions assuming a broader application and participation?
Is that about right? And so because of all that, what exactly would you propose we do from PPOS?
I’m not saying the company, or Ed, or his legions of black-hooded minions of Satan or whatever face people want to put on the guys that sit across the table from DALPA are innocent and blameless. There’s plenty of blame to go around. What I am saying, in my opinion, is that the MECs tough-guy approach has precipitated much of this standoff, and the standoff is unlikely to end. I believe the company will proceed, at their own pace, with their plan for cost savings, without engaging the MEC any more than is absolutely necessary. And that is and will be a failure on both sides.
You demand me to ‘propose exactly what we should do’. I can’t say exactly because I don’t know. I do think that, as a general idea, both sides could gain a lot by softening their stance and resuming negotiations. If this brings about mutual gains, it’s a win. Like Michael Corleone said, it’s nothing personal. It’s just business.
05-13-2020, 08:34 AM
#87
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2015
Posts: 4,116
Originally Posted by Hank Kingsley
So you are going to be furloughed? Or displaced and retire because you can't hack a school. Which one?
Btw those are your words. Not mine.
Its simple reality the older you get the calculation of time and trade off for work and money is regularly considered.
Since you are gambling...Its a safe bet 60+ yr olds are going to look at this turmoil in the context of what has beem 3 decades of tumultuous employment, count the +/- of enduring the BS and stress and come to the conclusion its time to go fishing.
05-13-2020, 08:36 AM
#88
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2015
Posts: 1,677
Originally Posted by gloopy
You blame the MEC, deflect on the blame for Ed and/or the team directly under his command, then posit this theory?
This isn't anywhere near similar to the VB situation where they sat on it way past the agreed upon timeline, promised to discuss their plans with us, then suddenly and overnight sandbagged us with something different "just because they could" so we finally had enough and pulled it down. So now you think because of that, they fake negotiated something that would have saved them a ton of money, cost any participating pilots some money, then pulled it down immediately, well within the timeline agreed upon, out of some semblance of spite, where the only cost to either party was to them by reducing prescious cash reserves by tens of millions, perhaps hundreds of millions assuming a broader application and participation?
Is that about right? And so because of all that, what exactly would you propose we do from PPOS?
This isn't anywhere near similar to the VB situation where they sat on it way past the agreed upon timeline, promised to discuss their plans with us, then suddenly and overnight sandbagged us with something different "just because they could" so we finally had enough and pulled it down. So now you think because of that, they fake negotiated something that would have saved them a ton of money, cost any participating pilots some money, then pulled it down immediately, well within the timeline agreed upon, out of some semblance of spite, where the only cost to either party was to them by reducing prescious cash reserves by tens of millions, perhaps hundreds of millions assuming a broader application and participation?
Is that about right? And so because of all that, what exactly would you propose we do from PPOS?
05-13-2020, 09:58 AM
#90
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2015
Position: Power top
Posts: 2,959
Originally Posted by BobZ
Hack school? Actually im in school now.
Btw those are your words. Not mine.
Its simple reality the older you get the calculation of time and trade off for work and money is regularly considered.
Since you are gambling...Its a safe bet 60+ yr olds are going to look at this turmoil in the context of what has beem 3 decades of tumultuous employment, count the +/- of enduring the BS and stress and come to the conclusion its time to go fishing.
Btw those are your words. Not mine.
Its simple reality the older you get the calculation of time and trade off for work and money is regularly considered.
Since you are gambling...Its a safe bet 60+ yr olds are going to look at this turmoil in the context of what has beem 3 decades of tumultuous employment, count the +/- of enduring the BS and stress and come to the conclusion its time to go fishing.
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