Perhaps a poor choice of words on my part.

If it were the case that someone was interested in helping their friends, it would not be the first time. As I recall, Chuck Giambusso used similar reasoning when he expressed concerns that ASA & Comair guys would make Delta an undesireable place for military pilots to seek employment.

I was trying to explain a concern some of my friends have (after one was on the phone to me bending my ear on the issue). Consider that the DCI carriers are mostly mortal enemies. They fight amongst themselves for the scraps of Delta's left over flying. Those who can't get the scraps end up losing their jobs ... ACA, Comair, Freedom, etc ....

I always understood it for what it was, whipsaw. Others take it pretty personally. In the case of GoJets I agree with them because of the harm they did to ALPA and Trans States. Management beats the competitive drums pretty loudly too.

My business partner flew a shot up Marine Corps F4, single engine, losing hydraulics to a night trap. "Angst" is not the word I recall he uses when he talks about that night. If that was your ride with the inflight fire, that sounds pretty pucker inducing as well. Certainly nothing here rises to that level, but folks do have opinions about pilot hiring.

For the record, it has always been my written opinion that if Delta wants to buy and operate an airline, fine. Make them Delta pilots & give them a number. (so the requirement change is not a personal matter to me ... I'd go as far as to applaud a staple with concomitant closing of "permitted" flying)

If you scan down the booklet, you see that there are 49 in service (you can get the ship numbers on page 37), and 9 in storage (ships # 9237-9245, page 40), probably undergoing some form of mod, and then we have the 7 yet to be delivered. My cyphering indicates, 49 in service, 9 undergoing mod, 7 yet to be delivered, total of 65 when all is said and done. That would be consistent with both the projections from the code share committee and the 4Q fleet booklet.

I'm guessing you didn't get why the B-scalers in the 80s were upset, either. Moving it off property doesn't change anything.

If there's negotiating history that indicated Delta intended to hire Pinnacle pilots at a given success ratio, they have a grievance. We have no grievance. You're doing that typical ALPA guy thing where you put words in my mouth. There was no harm to Delta pilots - only to Pinnacle pilots. We have no grounds for a grievance, but we can certainly indicate our distaste through a resolution delivered to the DAL Board of Directors via certified mail. At least that way we have something to show for ourselves if this thing backfires.

There's nothing more powerful than an "I told you so".[/QUOTE]

No it's not an ALPA guy tactic. What I am trying to do is when having a concern use the correct word usage and point to the correct document and correct corrective action. The company fufilled their responsibility to the exclusive agent (ALPA) under the rla. The company did not violate our exclusivity as defined by the rla or the PWA. It's I'd not something that can be taken to grievance. Now if there is in fact a section of the PWA that is violated that is a different story. Exclusivity was not.

Do not throw around a term like that when you use it incorrectly. A B Scale is the same work for the same job. Ie different pay on the 767 FO seat for two different pilots. It's not less pay on different seats. Don't muddy the waters

Bar,

So now it's a NWA thing????? Get a life things aren't that bad here!

Generally no.

Folks like me who post a lot (~ 6,700) know that people fact check us, research our posts and hold us accountable.

It seems you ( 42 posts ) come here when ALPA has political problems deliberately post in such a way as to introduce false issues to distract from the malfeasance of your political friends. ( like your bringing up the RJDC when Dan Ford and Ken Cooksey never dreamed of trying to lock the Delta MEC out of the room like Lee Moak just did to the Delta pilots ... we Delta pilots were completely taken for granted ... not even a "how do you do?" )

A man of integrity looks past the politicians to the real issues. We hope ALPA and Delta will both be here long after our brief time on the stage has passed. The more important issues involve the governance of our union so that it remains an ongoing entity.

So, what office do you currently hold on behalf of our association?

The ALPA press release says guaranteed hiring for many Pinnacle pilots.

That damned ALPA Press Office.

Have to admit is was funny to have two Status Reps call me a "liar" when I was quoting directly from ALPA's own press releases. :rolleyes:

ALPA National has completely taken the complacency of the Delta pilots for granted. They are not even bothering to tell the Delta MEC what they have negotiated with our management.

If you haven't been paying attention, I will recap. I support the Pinnacle pilots bridge agreement and I welcome them to Delta. I don't think they are unworthy of being Delta pilots and if there are a few that don't fit into Delta's culture then Delta's HR department will make that decision and not me. They have been doing that for many, many years without my help and I am sure they can struggle on without me.

My point was that I am tired of hearing guys that got their experience in the civilian side tell me I don't understand because military guys have it so easy. Somehow they assume that I graduated from high school and then an angel came down from heaven and handed me a diploma, a set of military wings, and my Delta uniform. They say I can't understand the angst of working through the civilian ranks to get to Delta.

Flying in the military was difficult and dangerous. The washout rate in UPT is close to 40% or at least it was when I was there. Within three weeks of me showing up at my pilot training base there was a fatal accident. We had about 150 pilots at the last base I was assigned to and there were four fatal accidents in 2.5 years. My life was spent at 100 feet above the ground and 480 KIAS doing high g maneuvering in terrain. I understand angst in the flying world.

I don't support the contention that some military pilots have that civilian pilots are weak and unworthy. I also bristle at the suggestion that I had it easy because I went into the military. Finally, I don't understand how settling old grudges between RJ pilot groups becomes the top priority of the Delta MEC.

The Pinnacle pilots are in a terrible spot due to no fault of their own, their management was incompetent and left them with two terrible choices. If they get a hand up to get a job at Delta to relieve a portion of that suffering then I support it. It just seems to be the human thing to do.