sailingfun

I did find and listen to it and that’s not close to what he said. I also am willing to bet everyone gets furlough pay. I doubt he was even referencing that. It’s fractions of a penny compared to the scope side. I do expect they will invoke it on scope since they are in violation of numerous parts of our contract if they don’t reach a agreement with the union. I suspect however some agreement will be reached with the union because they will recognize that they will lose a FM arbitration with most of the worlds air travel shut down. It’s hard to fly anything approaching our minimum block hour requirements when there is no where to fly and it will be years before demand matches some of our contractual requirements. The challenge will be crafting a agreement as flying picks up that insures our fair share of the flying while accounting for international agreements, JV agreements and government mandated route allotments.
Do you really believe that this is not a FM situation with regard to international scope and if not can you tell us what you think might qualify?

Crown

absolutely not. This is not a situation where FM applies. No one forced Delta into these failed JVs that have cost billions. They CHOSE to go down that route. It paid off quite a bit in the good times, but in the bad, you see the financial flaws that outsourcing your international flying has.

furthermore, taking BILLIONS VOLUNTARILY from the government to meet payroll nixes FM. Delta has had nearly 6 months to get its financial house in order and has done a pretty good job of it, but we know they’ve made mistakes on the pilot front with not offering SILs, blank lines, etc.

this is yet another failure of leadership from JL. Anyone who isn’t disgusted by this man is someone I don’t want anything to do with.

sailingfun

So give me a hint where Delta could fly international flights and meet as a example our minimum block hour requirements in the Pacific and actually generate revenue? Please also tell me with 90% of the worlds international travel shut down what you would consider a FM event? Maybe nuclear war that kills 90% of the worlds population?
I can tell you the union fully understands they will lose if they push the issue in arbitration. That’s why they have not even said boo about it. There will be a time as flying returns to start the discussion. The last thing the union wants now would be to push the issue and lose in arbitration. Much smarter to wait until there is actually flying to fight over. Life is hard, it’s harder when your stupid, you don’t want a stupid union.
I do not believe as far as furlough pay this is a FM situation. We would win that one at the system board and not even get to arbitration.

iaflyer

The short answer is we can't fly much of anywhere internationally - the optimal solution would be for ALPA to recognize that there just isn't any flying, suspend the JV balance until some travel metric is met in exchange for some improved balance in the future. I think if the union just gave them nothing there would be some howls of protests, and remember a LOA would likely need MEMRAT. That might not pass if it's just a give.

sailingfun

I miss typed the FM part on furlough. I don’t believe it’s a FM situation for furlough pay.

sailingfun

The real answer is the union will do nothing and won’t file a grievance. When the flying comes back the discussions will begin. If we push the issue now and lose in arbitration we shift bargaining power to the company when the flying comes back. This situation is exactly what FM is written into contracts for. We are not going to force the company to add 150 widebody international flights a day next month.

Cogf16

When are YS processed, at the next window or 0700 day before the trip? Looking to get a "fini flight" before 1 Sep. Thanks

buckleyboy

This truism should be in the something-to-make-you-laugh thread.
Edit word order. And the irony was not lost on me in my error. 😜

horseface

Swindlers: “we have nowhere to fly to meet the scope requirements”

us: “pull delta code off of enough (codeshare) flights To bring yourselves into balance”

what am I missing?

sailingfun

You’re missing that we have minimum block hour requirements as well as balance requirements. Go to the ALPA webpage and look up one of the scope compliance reports. It will give you the concept of all the various scope requirements the company must meet.
Example:January 1, 2015 and on each January 1 for each measurement period thereafter (each 12- 18 month period, a “measurement period”), until December 31, 2020, the Company will 19 schedule no fewer than 5,860 international operations of Company flying between the 20 United States and London Heathrow (LHR).