Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?
07-13-2011 | 08:20 AM
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Lee going to National will not stop him from wielding influence on DALPA. To believe otherwise is far fetched.
07-13-2011 | 08:33 AM
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From: Light Chop
The interpretation of a PWA violation by RAH is gaining traction.
RAH apparently is getting worried about this:
Republic Tried (And Failed) To Postpone Pilot Union Election Tally - Things in the Sky
write your reps, ask them specifically to read the definition of the term domestic carrier in the PWA.
(Hint: “air carrier” means a citizen of the United States undertaking by any means, directly or indirectly, to provide air transportation.)
Here is the key: the NMB found RAH to be a single transportation system for pilot representation purposes. Sure we cant use that ruling, but that doesn't mean that their published findings are invalid.
In other words -- in order to rule STS the NMB had to investigate RAH and has published the "evidence". All we have to do is use the already established "evidence" to bring our case.
Why any of this matters?
If we don't defend the contract we have, what else is there to defend?
Cheers
George
RAH apparently is getting worried about this:
Republic Tried (And Failed) To Postpone Pilot Union Election Tally - Things in the Sky
write your reps, ask them specifically to read the definition of the term domestic carrier in the PWA.
(Hint: “air carrier” means a citizen of the United States undertaking by any means, directly or indirectly, to provide air transportation.)
Here is the key: the NMB found RAH to be a single transportation system for pilot representation purposes. Sure we cant use that ruling, but that doesn't mean that their published findings are invalid.
In other words -- in order to rule STS the NMB had to investigate RAH and has published the "evidence". All we have to do is use the already established "evidence" to bring our case.
Why any of this matters?
If we don't defend the contract we have, what else is there to defend?
Cheers
George
1.the Board cited the following indicia of a single transportation system:
a.In Trans World Airlines/Ozark Airlines, [W]hether a combined schedule is published; how the carrier advertises its services; whether reservation systems are combined; whether tickets are issued on one carrier’s stock; if signs, logos and other publicly visible indicia have been changed to indicate only one carrier’s existence; whether personnel with public contact were held out as employees of one carrier; and whether the process of repainting planes and other equipment, to eliminate indications of separate existence, has been progressed.
38 NMB No. 39 - 154 –
b.Other factors investigated by the Board seek to determine if the carriers have combined their operations from a managerial and labor relations perspective. Here the Board investigates whether labor relations and personnel functions are handled by one carrier; whether there are a common management, common corporate officers and interlocking Boards of Directors; whether there is a combined workforce; and whether separate identities are maintained for corporate and other purposes.
14 NMB 218, 236 (1987).
2.The Board finds a single transportation system only when there is substantial integration of operations, financial control, and labor and personnel functions. 38 NMB No. 39 - 154 –
b.Other factors investigated by the Board seek to determine if the carriers have combined their operations from a managerial and labor relations perspective. Here the Board investigates whether labor relations and personnel functions are handled by one carrier; whether there are a common management, common corporate officers and interlocking Boards of Directors; whether there is a combined workforce; and whether separate identities are maintained for corporate and other purposes.
14 NMB 218, 236 (1987).
a.Northwest Airlines, Inc./Delta Air Lines, Inc., 37 NMB 88 (2009);
b.Florida N. R.R, 34 NMB 142 (2007);
c.GoJet Airlines, LLC and Trans States Airlines, Inc., 33 NMB 24 (2005);
d.Burlington N. Santa Fe Ry. Co., 32 NMB 163 (2005).
3.Further, the Board has noted that a substantial degree of overlapping ownership, senior management, and Boards of Directors is critical to finding a single transportation system. b.Florida N. R.R, 34 NMB 142 (2007);
c.GoJet Airlines, LLC and Trans States Airlines, Inc., 33 NMB 24 (2005);
d.Burlington N. Santa Fe Ry. Co., 32 NMB 163 (2005).
a.Precision Valley Aviation, Inc., d/b/a Precision Airlines and Valley Flying Serv., Inc., d/b/a Northeast Express Reg’l Airlines, 20 NMB 619 (1993).
4. The Board’s substantial integration of operations criteria does not, however, require total integration of operations. a.Allegheny Airlines, Inc. and Piedmont Airlines, Inc., 32 NMB 21, 28 (2004).
5. Labor relations are often indicia of single transportation systems. a.See Atlas Air, Inc./Polar Air Cargo Worldwide, Inc., 35 NMB 259, 269 (2008) (single system found in spite of separate operating certificates due in part to substantial overlap among Boards of Directors and senior managers).
6. ...consolidation of senior managers, personnel functions, and labor relations are often indicia of single transportation systems. (sort of repeat) a.See Atlas Air, Inc./Polar Air Cargo Worldwide, Inc., 35 NMB 259, 269 (2008) (single system found in spite of separate operating certificates due in part to substantial overlap among Boards of Directors and senior managers).
7. ...the Board found a single transportation system to exist primarily because of the significant degree of “common control”: a.In Flagship Airlines, Inc., 22 NMB 331 (1995), a case with facts very similar to those present here, the Board found a single transportation system to exist primarily because of the significant degree of “common control” exercised by Eagle over its subsidiaries. Id. at 426. Eagle wholly-owned and centrally controlled the four subsidiaries; there existed interlocking boards of directors, common corporate officers, and common management; the carriers held themselves out to the public as a single carrier, and flight schedules and reservations were integrated; and while most employee groups were represented by separate organizations/CBAs, Eagle handled most other labor
Now look at what the NMB said about RAH as it related to STS for the purpose of representation, but that's the question that was asked. It's like asking a serial killer if he murdered someone and he sits there and explains not only that he is but how he did it to others, their names, when and where it happened and where the evidence is. Now all the cops need to do is ask, did you murder these other people? ASK. If not ask, then do the smart thing and make the definition of air carrier mean that any holdings company is automatically STS. 1.RAH Ownership
a.All subsidiaries are wholly owned by RAH, but each holds its own FAA operating certificate.8 Management between the Carriers has already been integrated.
2.RAH Management a.The same Board of Directors and senior management team oversee all of the Carriers.
b.Bryan Bedford is the Chairman and CEO for all of the Carriers. He is also the President of RA, Shuttle, Chautauqua, and Frontier.
c.Robert H. (Hal) Cooper is the Executive Vice President, CFO, Treasurer and Secretary.
d.Wayne Heller is the Executive Vice President, COO for all the Carriers.
e.Ron Henson is the Vice President, Labor Relations
f.Kathy Wooldridge is the Vice President, Human Resources, for all the Carriers.
3.RAH Controlb.Bryan Bedford is the Chairman and CEO for all of the Carriers. He is also the President of RA, Shuttle, Chautauqua, and Frontier.
c.Robert H. (Hal) Cooper is the Executive Vice President, CFO, Treasurer and Secretary.
d.Wayne Heller is the Executive Vice President, COO for all the Carriers.
e.Ron Henson is the Vice President, Labor Relations
f.Kathy Wooldridge is the Vice President, Human Resources, for all the Carriers.
a.RAH exercises control over the management, labor relations, and human resources functions of all of its subsidiaries including Pilot recruitment.
4.RAH Marketing a.RAH holds out to the public that the Carriers are part of a consolidated entity as shown at its website, http://www.rjet.com/.
5.RAH Scheduling a.While RAH’s business model is one that includes both “fixed-fee” and “branded” operations, its operations are consolidated and “branded” operations are commonly-scheduled under the Frontier brand.
i.For example, the route map available at Frontier and RAH’s websites provides that: “Flights are operated by Frontier, Lynx, Republic Airways, or Chautauqua Airlines.” In addition, RAH’s subsidiaries are presented on a consolidated basis for both financial reporting and operating performance. See Quarterly Financial Statement, August 9, 2010; September 2010 Press Release “Republic Airways Reports September 2010 Traffic.”
a.This type of consolidation of senior managers, personnel functions, and labor relations are often indicia of single transportation systems. See Atlas Air, Inc./Polar Air Cargo Worldwide, Inc., 35 NMB 259, 269 (2008) (single system found in spite of separate operating certificates due in part to substantial overlap among Boards of Directors and senior managers).
b.RAH exercises control over the management, labor relations, and human resources functions of all of its subsidiaries including Pilot recruitment. Further, RAH holds out to the public that the Carriers are part of a consolidated entity as shown at its website, http://www.rjet.com/. While RAH’s business model is one that includes both “fixed-fee” and “branded” operations, its operations are consolidated and “branded” operations are commonly-scheduled under the Frontier brand. For example, the route map available at Frontier and RAH’s websites provides that: “Flights are operated by Frontier, Lynx, Republic Airways, or Chautauqua Airlines.” In addition, RAH’s subsidiaries are presented on a consolidated basis for both financial reporting and operating performance. See Quarterly Financial Statement, August 9, 2010; September 2010 Press Release “Republic Airways Reports September 2010 Traffic.”
07-13-2011 | 08:35 AM
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07-13-2011 | 08:40 AM
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My personal opinion is I would prefer 3. There are a myriad of minutiae issues that will arise during committee deliberations and after a thorough discussion, if the issue is 2-1, you press on. But with 4, if it's 2-2, you're in a deadlock over what is likely an issue of not that much significance. That leads to a very inefficient system, imo. I also honestly don't care what the pre-merger background of any pilot on that committee is. With the exception of the NWA DB, we are all working under the same contract, and all affected by the decisions of this MEC in the same way. Their pre-merger affiliation is irrelevant to me, and for the life of me, I can't understand why so many are still hung up over that.
If the individual members of the MEC don''t start viewing themselves as Delta pilots, rather than fNWA or fDAL pilots, we are all truly doomed. I have confidence that, IF THEY CAN GET BEYOND THAT, they will pick the best group (it may very well be the same 4, or it may not be, I don't know and don't care) and we will do great, regardless of the size of the committee.
Just my opinion.
If the individual members of the MEC don''t start viewing themselves as Delta pilots, rather than fNWA or fDAL pilots, we are all truly doomed. I have confidence that, IF THEY CAN GET BEYOND THAT, they will pick the best group (it may very well be the same 4, or it may not be, I don't know and don't care) and we will do great, regardless of the size of the committee.
Just my opinion.
07-13-2011 | 09:19 AM
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From: LAX ERA
My personal opinion is I would prefer 3. There are a myriad of minutiae issues that will arise during committee deliberations and after a thorough discussion, if the issue is 2-1, you press on. But with 4, if it's 2-2, you're in a deadlock over what is likely an issue of not that much significance. That leads to a very inefficient system, imo. I also honestly don't care what the pre-merger background of any pilot on that committee is. With the exception of the NWA DB, we are all working under the same contract, and all affected by the decisions of this MEC in the same way. Their pre-merger affiliation is irrelevant to me, and for the life of me, I can't understand why so many are still hung up over that.
If the individual members of the MEC don''t start viewing themselves as Delta pilots, rather than fNWA or fDAL pilots, we are all truly doomed. I have confidence that, IF THEY CAN GET BEYOND THAT, they will pick the best group (it may very well be the same 4, or it may not be, I don't know and don't care) and we will do great, regardless of the size of the committee.
Just my opinion.
If the individual members of the MEC don''t start viewing themselves as Delta pilots, rather than fNWA or fDAL pilots, we are all truly doomed. I have confidence that, IF THEY CAN GET BEYOND THAT, they will pick the best group (it may very well be the same 4, or it may not be, I don't know and don't care) and we will do great, regardless of the size of the committee.
Just my opinion.
I had heard a guy I respect opine that 4 would be a good number due to the increased workload of a larger group. But, I see the deadlock issue and I guess 5 would be too many guys on FPL
I agree I'm not that interested in what a guys premerger group is, only that they reflect the will of the group. Which, I would argue, is less company friendly than years past. However, we may be dealing with human nature somewhat as I've talked to old Hughes Airwest guys that refer to themselves as Hughes guys (not even "green guys")........and that is how many mergers ago now?
Last edited by Ferd149; 07-13-2011 at 09:36 AM.
07-13-2011 | 09:26 AM
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From: Space Shuttle PIC
What is the latest on early outs? When is the deadline? I saw the 744 and A330 numbers yesterday. Are they the same?
07-13-2011 | 09:28 AM
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From: Space Shuttle PIC
07-13-2011 | 09:37 AM
Can't abide NAI
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From: Douglas Aerospace post production Flight Test & Work Around Engineering bulletin dissembler
07-13-2011 | 09:47 AM
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From: A-320A
Thanks, I appreciate the perspective.
I had heard a guy I respect opine that 4 would be a good number due to the increased workload of a larger group. But, I see the deadlock issue and I guess 5 would be too many guys on FPL
I agree I'm not that interested in what a guys premerger group is, only that they reflect the will of the group. Which, I would argue, is less company friendly than years past. However, we may be dealing with human nature somewhat as I've talked to old Hughes Airwest guys that refer to themselves as Hughes guys (not even "green guys")........and that is how many mergers ago now?
I had heard a guy I respect opine that 4 would be a good number due to the increased workload of a larger group. But, I see the deadlock issue and I guess 5 would be too many guys on FPL
I agree I'm not that interested in what a guys premerger group is, only that they reflect the will of the group. Which, I would argue, is less company friendly than years past. However, we may be dealing with human nature somewhat as I've talked to old Hughes Airwest guys that refer to themselves as Hughes guys (not even "green guys")........and that is how many mergers ago now?
That is why the Master chair is a defacto member of the Negotiation Committee.
07-13-2011 | 09:51 AM
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From: LAX ERA
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