Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?
07-13-2011, 09:26 AM
Banned
Joined APC: Jul 2006
Position: Space Shuttle PIC
Posts: 2,007
What is the latest on early outs? When is the deadline? I saw the 744 and A330 numbers yesterday. Are they the same?
07-13-2011, 09:28 AM
Banned
Joined APC: Jul 2006
Position: Space Shuttle PIC
Posts: 2,007
Originally Posted by Pineapple Guy
If Lee is having undo influence on your individual rep, you should recall that rep. I have no such concerns regarding my elected reps.
07-13-2011, 09:37 AM
Can't abide NAI
Joined APC: Jun 2007
Position: Douglas Aerospace post production Flight Test & Work Around Engineering bulletin dissembler
Posts: 11,993
Originally Posted by JoeMerchant
Bar, there are plenty of us still here who fully intend this policy to be complied with.
07-13-2011, 09:47 AM
Happy to be here
Joined APC: Jun 2006
Position: A-320A
Posts: 18,563
Originally Posted by Ferd149
Thanks, I appreciate the perspective.
I had heard a guy I respect opine that 4 would be a good number due to the increased workload of a larger group. But, I see the deadlock issue and I guess 5 would be too many guys on FPL
I agree I'm not that interested in what a guys premerger group is, only that they reflect the will of the group. Which, I would argue, is less company friendly than years past. However, we may be dealing with human nature somewhat as I've talked to old Hughes Airwest guys that refer to themselves as Hughes guys (not even "green guys")........and that is how many mergers ago now?
I had heard a guy I respect opine that 4 would be a good number due to the increased workload of a larger group. But, I see the deadlock issue and I guess 5 would be too many guys on FPL
I agree I'm not that interested in what a guys premerger group is, only that they reflect the will of the group. Which, I would argue, is less company friendly than years past. However, we may be dealing with human nature somewhat as I've talked to old Hughes Airwest guys that refer to themselves as Hughes guys (not even "green guys")........and that is how many mergers ago now?
That is why the Master chair is a defacto member of the Negotiation Committee.
07-13-2011, 09:51 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: LAX ERA
Posts: 3,457
Originally Posted by acl65pilot
That is why the Master chair is a defacto member of the Negotiation Committee.
Don't do this to me, I'm the product of a public school education.Ferd
07-13-2011, 10:05 AM
At home on the maddog!
Joined APC: Mar 2009
Position: ATL MD-88A
Posts: 2,874
Originally Posted by Bucking Bar
... and it will be complied with. My poorly stated point was that the boogey man the DPA seeks to resurrect for political use has ascended into retirement.
I don't understand your thinking on this. DPA's concerns on the language in the ALPA Administrative Manual seem legit to me. It's just like our poorly written, loop hole ridden, scope language. You can't just bury your head in the sand and say, "oh no big deal, nobody will ever use that."
Last edited by DAL 88 Driver; 07-13-2011 at 10:43 AM.
07-13-2011, 10:28 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2009
Position: right for a long, long time
Posts: 2,642
Originally Posted by Bucking Bar
The DPA can't offer a solution until they correctly identify the problem. Blaming National will not change anything.
It will do a number of things, all of which will be good for Delta Pilots.
1) The LEC reps will understand that they have a large number of pilots who are willing so be active in their commitment to restoration and that they expect actions and communications from their reps that reflect that, if not then they will be replaced with a rep who is on board with that message.
2) It will show that the DPA is more than just a vocal discontented group of pilots, and that they are intent on taking action.
3) Give a "member-driven" agenda to the MEC to act upon. It is said by many DALPA proponents (and I am one of them as of now), that if you want to see change, go to meetings, send up resolutions, get involved. If 3000 pilots (and I'm sure many like-minded in all respects of restoring the profession but not wanting to go solo to get there) it would have potentially unifying results.
DPA propents better step up to the plate when it comes time for negotiations to ensue.....I still want to see 3000+ members volunteer for the SPC when called upon to send a message to DAL management that we are ready, willing, and that we truly demand restoration.
DPA needs to show me a "body of work" before I can believe that it will be better with a different bargaining agent. Show me some concrete examples of accomplishment, small at first and growing larger over time that PROVE to me that the theory and efficacy of their ideas produce results. I'm not voting for a group that hasn't proved to me that they can accomplish goals to improve my career as a Delta Pilot.
So far, DALPA is doing ok...Not excellent, just ok. The results are satisfactory for work outside Section 6, the communication to the pilot group on "clarity of purpose and mission" from DALPA stinks.
I think of DALPA and the "best contracts ever negotitated" argument with the investment disclaimer: "Past returns do not garauntee future results."
All I can say for DPA thus far: ...............................
DPA proponents better step up to the plate when it comes time for negotiations to ensue.....I still want to see 3000+ members volunteer for the SPC when called upon to send a message to DAL management that we are ready, willing, and that we truly demand restoration.
07-13-2011, 10:43 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,324
Originally Posted by Pineapple Guy
I have no such concerns regarding my elected reps.
07-13-2011, 10:51 AM
At home on the maddog!
Joined APC: Mar 2009
Position: ATL MD-88A
Posts: 2,874
Originally Posted by shiznit
I still don't understand why the DPA crowd doesn't put any real energy into a signed pledge or "contract with Delta Pilots" that they take to each LEC rep, and if they don't get on board with it, start a recall process. If the DPA supporters are genuinely desire change to the point of actually taking action.
It will do a number of things, all of which will be good for Delta Pilots.
1) The LEC reps will understand that they have a large number of pilots who are willing so be active in their commitment to restoration and that they expect actions and communications from their reps that reflect that, if not then they will be replaced with a rep who is on board with that message.
2) It will show that the DPA is more than just a vocal discontented group of pilots, and that they are intent on taking action.
3) Give a "member-driven" agenda to the MEC to act upon. It is said by many DALPA proponents (and I am one of them as of now), that if you want to see change, go to meetings, send up resolutions, get involved. If 3000 pilots (and I'm sure many like-minded in all respects of restoring the profession but not wanting to go solo to get there) it would have potentially unifying results.
DPA propents better step up to the plate when it comes time for negotiations to ensue.....I still want to see 3000+ members volunteer for the SPC when called upon to send a message to DAL management that we are ready, willing, and that we truly demand restoration.
DPA needs to show me a "body of work" before I can believe that it will be better with a different bargaining agent. Show me some concrete examples of accomplishment, small at first and growing larger over time that PROVE to me that the theory and efficacy of their ideas produce results. I'm not voting for a group that hasn't proved to me that they can accomplish goals to improve my career as a Delta Pilot.
So far, DALPA is doing ok...Not excellent, just ok. The results are satisfactory for work outside Section 6, the communication to the pilot group on "clarity of purpose and mission" from DALPA stinks.
I think of DALPA and the "best contracts ever negotitated" argument with the investment disclaimer: "Past returns do not garauntee future results."
All I can say for DPA thus far: ...............................
DPA proponents better step up to the plate when it comes time for negotiations to ensue.....I still want to see 3000+ members volunteer for the SPC when called upon to send a message to DAL management that we are ready, willing, and that we truly demand restoration.
It will do a number of things, all of which will be good for Delta Pilots.
1) The LEC reps will understand that they have a large number of pilots who are willing so be active in their commitment to restoration and that they expect actions and communications from their reps that reflect that, if not then they will be replaced with a rep who is on board with that message.
2) It will show that the DPA is more than just a vocal discontented group of pilots, and that they are intent on taking action.
3) Give a "member-driven" agenda to the MEC to act upon. It is said by many DALPA proponents (and I am one of them as of now), that if you want to see change, go to meetings, send up resolutions, get involved. If 3000 pilots (and I'm sure many like-minded in all respects of restoring the profession but not wanting to go solo to get there) it would have potentially unifying results.
DPA propents better step up to the plate when it comes time for negotiations to ensue.....I still want to see 3000+ members volunteer for the SPC when called upon to send a message to DAL management that we are ready, willing, and that we truly demand restoration.
DPA needs to show me a "body of work" before I can believe that it will be better with a different bargaining agent. Show me some concrete examples of accomplishment, small at first and growing larger over time that PROVE to me that the theory and efficacy of their ideas produce results. I'm not voting for a group that hasn't proved to me that they can accomplish goals to improve my career as a Delta Pilot.
So far, DALPA is doing ok...Not excellent, just ok. The results are satisfactory for work outside Section 6, the communication to the pilot group on "clarity of purpose and mission" from DALPA stinks.
I think of DALPA and the "best contracts ever negotitated" argument with the investment disclaimer: "Past returns do not garauntee future results."
All I can say for DPA thus far: ...............................
DPA proponents better step up to the plate when it comes time for negotiations to ensue.....I still want to see 3000+ members volunteer for the SPC when called upon to send a message to DAL management that we are ready, willing, and that we truly demand restoration.
I see some merit in your idea about widespread recalls. I'd jump on board with that with my reps in a heartbeat if I thought it would do any good. But how does that solve the conflict of interest with ALPA National and the info/advice/services they provide to us? How does it make what's best for the Delta pilots the #1 priority and only consideration with the union representing us?
07-13-2011, 10:58 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2007
Posts: 593
Originally Posted by Ferd149
Thanks, I appreciate the perspective.
I had heard a guy I respect opine that 4 would be a good number due to the increased workload of a larger group. But, I see the deadlock issue and I guess 5 would be too many guys on FPL
I agree I'm not that interested in what a guys premerger group is, only that they reflect the will of the group. Which, I would argue, is less company friendly than years past. However, we may be dealing with human nature somewhat as I've talked to old Hughes Airwest guys that refer to themselves as Hughes guys (not even "green guys")........and that is how many mergers ago now?
I had heard a guy I respect opine that 4 would be a good number due to the increased workload of a larger group. But, I see the deadlock issue and I guess 5 would be too many guys on FPL
I agree I'm not that interested in what a guys premerger group is, only that they reflect the will of the group. Which, I would argue, is less company friendly than years past. However, we may be dealing with human nature somewhat as I've talked to old Hughes Airwest guys that refer to themselves as Hughes guys (not even "green guys")........and that is how many mergers ago now?
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