It certainly would not hurt to require and ATP and in times like this it is easy to find qualified applicants however when things are moving (if they ever do again :-) it is very difficult to find enough applicants with ATP to fill the demand.


And if I may side track a little to the “ALPA requiring” and “Compass” issues. DCI is a mess of one carrier being played against another always fighting for the scraps of flying and ultimately driving down wages at ALPA carriers. Why not have DALPA push for requiring the DCI carriers to only be ALPA carriers and setting a “minimum wage” for these carriers. If we are not going to fight to fly it ourselves at least we should have some control in the 500 “feeder” aircraft (that's just Delta) we have allowed to operate. There will continue to be a push on the scope limit as long as management can use DCI rates to make mainline look uncompetitive.

Perhaps raising minimums to entry would work. But I think we need to get our union involved. Perhaps you have to go to an approved APLA flight school? And after you graduate your ALAP approved school, you must pass a series of exams to demostrate a working knowledge of aviation?

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You guys really really need to read the Railway Labor Act. We are not like other unions. We operate under severe restrictions compared to most other unions. The RLA prohibits much of what you suggest ALPA should do. If you doubt the value of the RLA to management just look at what Fedex is threatening to do if removed from the RLA as a bill currently in congress would do.

Sailing, always the we can't attitude. :(


I actually don't think any of the things I wrote would be very easy to achieve and personally think they would be a waste to pursue. Just discussing ideas with Rhino and pointing out some of the problems we have created.


I would much rather see us go after recapturing all 70+ seat flying as the DCI contracts are up or the individual carriers no longer meet their performance triggers. I really wish we would go after the 50+ seaters but I am confident that will never happen. There are 149 70+ seat jets flying for Delta right now and 72 more at NW that's 221 aircraft that should be providing mainline block hours in the bid package.


As for the RLA, if it is changed it should be changed so that it applies to all carriers equally which would probably negate the terrible effects Fedex is claiming. Of course I don't want to see the airline industry become the next UAW either. We should be careful what we ask for.


Other than a few passing articles in AvDaily I haven't followed what is being proposed but I would guess that any management would be against it and would lobby in Washington and threaten job cuts. If more pilots supported ALPA-PAC we may actually see some favorable legislation come our way but than again it would be hard to compete with the 2.83 million that just Delta/NW spent lobbying in the last 6 months.

:)

Support ALPA PAC.

I definately think you are barking up the right tree. Like others have said the RLA ties our hands a bit, but that doesn't mean the issue is dead.

One problem to supply/ safety is AOPA. Yes AOPA! AOPA wants to protect current training standards including those guided by Part 61 of the FARs. Essentially part 61 outlines training guidlines for pilots who do not choose to have formal standardized training under part 141. This is like letting someone achieve a law degree and practice without training from an acredited school. The reality of part 61 is that students are not held to the same standards as those from the military and most part 141 schools. I am all for letting someone get a private license under part 61, no one should be allowed to train for a commercial license in such a loose environment. I we believe if we tighten standards on requirements for obtaining commercial certificates we will see increased safety and less pilots available to whipsaw us.

Why AOPA and why is the FAA on board? AOPA is an organization that protects the rights of general aviation pilots and aircraft owners. Allowing pilots to achieve ratings under part 61 makes aviation accessable to most people in the US. The FAA is there to REGULATE and PROMOTE aviation. OK isn't that an oxymoron? How can an organization promote and regulate at the same time. The answer is it can't. That is why the FAA is such a joke. That is why the NTSB findings and suggestions are largely ignored by the FAA. If the FAA listens to the NTSB they now have to regulate more and as a result the promotion of aviation wil be hurt. Because the FAA walks this fine line they are often subjected to inpt from lobbyist. This is were the importance of ALPA comes in to play. ALPA is our voice in Washington. Without ALPA we would be subjected to what "regulations" airline management and the FAA feel are best for the promotion of aviation. My guess is they are not the same as most of us think are fair and safe. The FAA should be set up with the same checks and balances as our own government. We should not have to spend hundreds of millions of are dues money every year to protect ourselves and the traveling public from a inadequate beauracracy and big business.

Yes Rhino ALPA can do something about it, just not directly through contracts and extortion, but through politics in Washington. Unfortunately with the passage of age 65 I feel ALPA doesn't understand supply and demand.

Just my 2 cents.

There have always been, and will always be, too many pilots. Orvill and Wilbur had to flip a coin to see who was going to fly the first airplane.

No one had even flown an airplane yet and the market already had twice the number of pilots it needed. Who got the job came down to mostly, chance.

Why, so they can change the retirement age to 67? I stopped "backing the PAC" when they used my donations to help change the retirement age to 65 which was against what most members wanted.

Nothing against you, but this is not a good idea. I am a product of the regionals. It looks like you are a product of the military. It is hard enough to get a job in the airline industry. The regionals are a place for low time pilots to get thier start. Hell, most of us didn't get our ATP until our first type rating and captain upgrade. Raising the requirements at the reigionals would not solve any of our current problems.