Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?
03-07-2012 | 09:35 AM
Happy to be here
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From: A-320A
The true test is the opener, a extension, modification and the final product which is the TA from any of these. If it falls short, this pilot group will boil over. What I have read on this forum is indicative of the cross section of this group. The middle of the road here is the middle of the road throughout this group. Expectations are high, and they should be. It is our first non-concessionary full section 6 in a decade.
03-07-2012 | 09:45 AM
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In the lounge it was being discussed that the new reserve system was concocted in order to help out some ALPA reps and good pals. The key is if enough guys complain, the new reserve system will get an overhaul. It really makes you start to think about the integrity of our current union.
Ever since we went to the RAW system, it's been universally hated for failing to respect seniority, for arbitrarily assigning SC, and failing to respect personal preferences. Many of us complained, and complained, until this was corrected. That job has already been done. Now you want to **** it up?
Are you actually on Reserve?
03-07-2012 | 09:56 AM
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Yeah there's more to this captain's story. Must be a small category, he is bidding to work weekends, or both. If you are the guy you're yhe guy....buckets and seniority be damned.
The new system is fine in construction but the buckets are too big as it's been said a hundred times. 60 Raw and I think it would be a lot better for everyone except those who are now on an almost permanent paid vacation. There's something wrong with a system that forces the vast majority of work on a few while paying others the same or more to do nothing. There's a reason communism failed.
The new system is fine in construction but the buckets are too big as it's been said a hundred times. 60 Raw and I think it would be a lot better for everyone except those who are now on an almost permanent paid vacation. There's something wrong with a system that forces the vast majority of work on a few while paying others the same or more to do nothing. There's a reason communism failed.
If there is a lot of flying, you can't hide: the flying will hit everyone. A bucket isn't a guarantee of not flying, it's a guarantee of being picked last.
The real value of the system, when there is almost no flying, is that the senior-most guy has a good chance at not having to fly. When this happens, this sytem incentivizes senior pilots to bid Reserve, and junior pilots have access to more lines. It also helps commuters: the junior pilot that wants to fly a lot, and be done, actually can. The RAW score system without buckets made sure he was a prisoner in his crashpad, constantly in limbo, not free to go home, but not getting used either.
The people that complaint the most are the the peopel that have to fly weekends. Considering how much we now whoare for more, it's a by-product of senior pilots putting in WS during the week, and there is nothing the RAW buckets will do to prevent it.
03-07-2012 | 09:57 AM
veut gagner à la loterie
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From: Light Chop
I took the time to quickly fill out the survey and then spent a lot of time on the open comments section at the end. Basically saying not to spend any time whatsoever on the uniform and then reiterating scope, reserve rules, vacation, training pay etc.
Fill out the survey, but do it your own way. It's another opportunity to get your views out there.
Fill out the survey, but do it your own way. It's another opportunity to get your views out there.
03-07-2012 | 10:04 AM
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I still don't understand why seniority is so important that we take reserve back to a straight seniority based system like white slip awards yet leave green slip awards in a spread the wealth system.
How important is seniority?
And this is coming from someone who is benefiting from the new system. Although, not as much as those with 12-14 years of seniority bidding T-Tail land MD88 B reserve. They win.
How important is seniority?
And this is coming from someone who is benefiting from the new system. Although, not as much as those with 12-14 years of seniority bidding T-Tail land MD88 B reserve. They win.
As for the second part, if a 12-14 year F/O "wins" by bidding 88 Reserve, does he/she not deserve to?
03-07-2012 | 10:05 AM
Happy to be here
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From: A-320A
I would argue that the bucket size isn't driving this. If there is moderate flying in a catgeory, and the bucket size is for example 80, then the more senior pilots will have to work in the second half, and they will have to keep working until their own RAW score gets them into the higher bucket, while the junior guy is hanging out. In other words, a bigger bucket, with a moderate amount fo flying, means the senior guy is more likely to start later in the month, when the junior guy will have a quiet period.
If there is a lot of flying, you can't hide: the flying will hit everyone. A bucket isn't a guarantee of not flying, it's a guarantee of being picked last.
The real value of the system, when there is almost no flying, is that the senior-most guy has a good chance at not having to fly. When this happens, this system incentivizes senior pilots to bid Reserve, and junior pilots have access to more lines. It also helps commuters: the junior pilot that wants to fly a lot, and be done, actually can. The RAW score system without buckets made sure he was a prisoner in his crashpad, constantly in limbo, not free to go home, but not getting used either.
The people that complaint the most are the the people that have to fly weekends. Considering how much we now who are for more, it's a by-product of senior pilots putting in WS during the week, and there is nothing the RAW buckets will do to prevent it.
If there is a lot of flying, you can't hide: the flying will hit everyone. A bucket isn't a guarantee of not flying, it's a guarantee of being picked last.
The real value of the system, when there is almost no flying, is that the senior-most guy has a good chance at not having to fly. When this happens, this system incentivizes senior pilots to bid Reserve, and junior pilots have access to more lines. It also helps commuters: the junior pilot that wants to fly a lot, and be done, actually can. The RAW score system without buckets made sure he was a prisoner in his crashpad, constantly in limbo, not free to go home, but not getting used either.
The people that complaint the most are the the people that have to fly weekends. Considering how much we now who are for more, it's a by-product of senior pilots putting in WS during the week, and there is nothing the RAW buckets will do to prevent it.
That is the only shortcoming I see with a simple bucket RAW value number.
03-07-2012 | 10:06 AM
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Agreed. I did say that the company can decide what uniforms we wear... they just need to pay for them. Until that time when we're asked to wear pink tutus to work, let's please not send out any more uniform surveys.
03-07-2012 | 10:09 AM
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Trip comes up.
Guess who flies?
You can try that again with 100 pilots, or 1,000. Still works the same.
03-07-2012 | 10:12 AM
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Sorry, I'm starting to use bold, underline, a lot. Next thing you know, I'm going to have to bring out the exclamation point! This issue really strikes a nerve with me: I've seen several different versions of Reserve at Delta, and the pure RAW system is by far the most heinous. I can't believe we would try to restore it when we just got done partially fixing it.
Later,
Sink r8.
Later,
Sink r8.
03-07-2012 | 10:13 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 1,044
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From: Lowest Pay I Could Find
I would argue that the bucket size isn't driving this. If there is moderate flying in a catgeory, and the bucket size is for example 80, then the more senior pilots will have to work in the second half, and they will have to keep working until their own RAW score gets them into the higher bucket, while the junior guy is hanging out. In other words, a bigger bucket, with a moderate amount fo flying, means the senior guy is more likely to start later in the month, when the junior guy will have a quiet period.
If there is a lot of flying, you can't hide: the flying will hit everyone. A bucket isn't a guarantee of not flying, it's a guarantee of being picked last.
The real value of the system, when there is almost no flying, is that the senior-most guy has a good chance at not having to fly. When this happens, this sytem incentivizes senior pilots to bid Reserve, and junior pilots have access to more lines. It also helps commuters: the junior pilot that wants to fly a lot, and be done, actually can. The RAW score system without buckets made sure he was a prisoner in his crashpad, constantly in limbo, not free to go home, but not getting used either.
The people that complaint the most are the the peopel that have to fly weekends. Considering how much we now whoare for more, it's a by-product of senior pilots putting in WS during the week, and there is nothing the RAW buckets will do to prevent it.
If there is a lot of flying, you can't hide: the flying will hit everyone. A bucket isn't a guarantee of not flying, it's a guarantee of being picked last.
The real value of the system, when there is almost no flying, is that the senior-most guy has a good chance at not having to fly. When this happens, this sytem incentivizes senior pilots to bid Reserve, and junior pilots have access to more lines. It also helps commuters: the junior pilot that wants to fly a lot, and be done, actually can. The RAW score system without buckets made sure he was a prisoner in his crashpad, constantly in limbo, not free to go home, but not getting used either.
The people that complaint the most are the the peopel that have to fly weekends. Considering how much we now whoare for more, it's a by-product of senior pilots putting in WS during the week, and there is nothing the RAW buckets will do to prevent it.
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