NERD

What about a cap that is based on the ALV? The higher the ALV the less you are allowed to WS. Low end of the ALV is say 72 hours, you're allowed alv+15. For every hour the ALV is raised, the pickup allowed is reduced 1 for 1.

shiznit

Agreed.....

DAL 88 Driver

That is encouraging. But what I fear is that our negotiators will cherry pick a few ideas from the letter and give us something that falls far short of significant restoration. If you take the ideas in that letter in total, it's a pretty big impact. If you just take a few of them, it really could water down the overall effect.

Herkflyr

So you are saying that junior guys have friends but senior guys don't? I think you are making something out of nothing here. We fixed the issue with "trip parking" awhile back. As it is I find the Swapboard to be an extremely useful tool. I have both picked up and dropped trips via the swapboard, but I would guess I have dropped twice as many as I have picked up. That has made my life at home a lot easier. I would hate to even consider not having the swapboard.

Then again I have flown with guys who have never swapped, dropped, traded, in their entire career--they just get their awarded line (line of time or PBS, it doesn't really matter) and fly it.

And you know what? That is great. It works for them. I just don't want them to mandate that that is the only option for me.

Sink r8

Thanks.

1) Not sure I understand your first question... If two pilots are friends, one is senior, and one is junior. Some junior guys have let the cat out of the bag that they get senior friends to pick, and shuttle trips to them. The trip-parking "fix" only prevents the trip from being shuttled back. You can send it to a third friend without any problem.

2) As far as restricting options, I'm advocating no such thing. I'm just saying that if you take pilots such as yourself, pilots that simply fly their schedule, and pilots who bid high via WS, or any other means, everyone deserves to share in any raise/restoration equally via payrates and other means. The guys who volunteer to pick up more via WS don't get to have an additional, extra special bump in hourly rate, which comes at the expense of everyone else, to incentivize extra flying. If they want to be patient, and improve their overall average payrate, they can bid a GS. If they're not patient enough, they get WS at the same average payrate as you and I. It's fair, it's good for staffing, it doesn't incentivize routine overtime, and it doesn't kill GS flying for everyone else.

Herkflyr

We may be more in agreement than not. I agree that if WS paid 1.5x above a certain amount, then it would not be very fair at all if a senior guy who already had 80 hours (for example) could WS a trip before a junior guy at 70. What if the rules was something like 1.5x all flying above 75 hours, but WS would be passed out in seniority order for all pilots currently below 75 hours, followed by pilots in seniority order currently projected above it?

Again, I don't see any reason to really change anything, but if we did, would need some sort of mechanism like that.

EdGrimley

At this point Moak is an anchor weighing down the piloting profession. Him and his disciples are preventing pilots from getting back to where they should be after the damage done leading up to and during bankruptcy. His mind is that of a Delta Air Lines manager, not a leader of pilot labor. This skews his desire and willingness to fight for things outside of what management jointly wants.

While I applaud his leadership in fending off players like Norwegian (every article from him in ALPA magazine), the scope of union boss should also encompass compensation (not as a low reset), unfavorable JV's and RJ outsourcing, items Moak omits with regularity.

"Moak contends that ALPA pilots at the larger carriers enjoy what he calls “mature, good contracts” already. Radical overhauls aren’t in the cards, he says."

"Airlines have been mum on what they’ll seek in the contract talks, despite some analyst queries on quarterly earnings calls. “We have a productive and proactive relationship with our pilots and ALPA, focused on winning in the marketplace and addressing our business challenges and opportunities together,” Delta spokeswoman Kate Modolo said in an e-mail."

Airline Profits Will Drive 2015 Pilot Contract Talks - Businessweek

NERD

Unfreakingbelievable





QUOTE=EdGrimley;1705387]At this point Moak is an anchor weighing down the piloting profession. Him and his disciples are preventing pilots from getting back to where they should be after the damage done leading up to and during bankruptcy. His mind is that of a Delta Air Lines manager, not a leader of pilot labor. This skews his desire and willingness to fight for things outside of what management jointly wants.

While I applaud his leadership in fending off players like Norwegian (every article from him in ALPA magazine), the scope of union boss should also encompass compensation (not as a low reset), unfavorable JV's and RJ outsourcing, items Moak omits with regularity.

"Moak contends that ALPA pilots at the larger carriers enjoy what he calls “mature, good contracts” already. Radical overhauls aren’t in the cards, he says."

"Airlines have been mum on what they’ll seek in the contract talks, despite some analyst queries on quarterly earnings calls. “We have a productive and proactive relationship with our pilots and ALPA, focused on winning in the marketplace and addressing our business challenges and opportunities together,” Delta spokeswoman Kate Modolo said in an e-mail."

Airline Profits Will Drive 2015 Pilot Contract Talks - Businessweek[/QUOTE]

DAL 88 Driver

Pilot Contract Talks in 2015 to Come Amid Robust Airline Profits

By Justin Bachman August 13, 2014
With U.S. airlines awash in cash these days, one of the big questions in the industry has become how much of that wealth will pilots seek next year when contracts at several carriers come up for renegotiation.



Contracts at four large airlines—Delta Air Lines (DAL), Hawaiian (HA), Spirit (SAVE), and Jazz Aviation, a regional operator for Air Canada—are up for talks in 2015, covering nearly 15,000 pilots represented by the Air Line Pilots Association, the largest pilots union in North America. JetBlue Airways’ (JBLU) 2,500 pilots are also hoping to secure their first contract next year, after voting this spring to join ALPA.


U.S. carriers are producing enormous profits after years of consolidation. In the most recent quarter, the six largest U.S. carriers collectively earned $3.97 billion, with American, Southwest, Alaska Airlines (ALK), and JetBlue all reporting record net income for the period. U.S. carriers lost almost $60 billion from 2000 to 2009.


“This is really a good story,” ALPA President Lee Moak said Tuesday during a visit to Bloomberg Businessweek in New York, part of a quick tour to assure Wall Street analysts that ALPA’s contract demands won’t prove onerous to airlines. “I almost can’t stand it, it’s so good.”


Shareholders have started to realize returns in the form of dividends and stock buybacks. Thanks to the profits, pilots now see themselves as collaborators with management—they increasingly lobby alongside airline executives in Washington. That, says Moak, deepens the working relationships. “All of a sudden, you find yourself on the same side of 95 percent of the issues,” he says.


Another boost has come from profit-sharing schemes adopted by the airlines as a way of rewarding employees when times are good—and the deals carry no commitments should profit shrink. In February, Delta paid employees, including its 11,900 pilots, a record $506 million in profit sharing, equal to about 8 percent of annual salaries. The airline forecasts that amount to increase next year, given higher profit this year.


Southwest expects to pay out $228 million to workers this year in profit shares, nearly double the amount from 2013. United paid $190 million in February tied to its income last year. (Delta and United make the payments on Valentine’s Day.) Several airlines also pay workers monthly incentives for meeting performance targets, such as more on-time arrivals and improvements on the rate of mishandled bags. United paid employees an extra $125 for meeting on-time arrival and departure goals in July. Delta says it paid nearly $92 million last year in similar incentives. “The employees are now coupled to the airlines,” says Moak, a Delta captain who is stepping down at year’s end after four years as president.
Of course, all the cash an airline generates can go to shareholders or employees, and that basic dynamic is likely to play out in the 2015 contract negotiations—especially at Delta and Spirit, both industry leaders when it comes to superior financial returns. Moak contends that ALPA pilots at the larger carriers enjoy what he calls “mature, good contracts” already. Radical overhauls aren’t in the cards, he says.


Most of the contract talks are likely to center on basic compensation—hourly pay rates and how much carriers pay into pilots’ retirement plans. “There will be a business discussion of pay as it relates to revenue,” Moak says. “You can argue about $2 or $2.05, and that matters to the crew member,” but “you’re working on the margins” on the new contracts, he says.


Airlines have been mum on what they’ll seek in the contract talks, despite some analyst queries on quarterly earnings calls. “We have a productive and proactive relationship with our pilots and ALPA, focused on winning in the marketplace and addressing our business challenges and opportunities together,” Delta spokeswoman Kate Modolo said in an e-mail. A Spirit spokesman, Paul Berry, declined to comment, as did a spokeswoman for Hawaiian, Alison Croyle.


The real test of all this bonhomie will come when the talks turn to money—and who will get it.
__________________________________________________ __


"The real test of all this bonhomie will come when the talks turn to money—and who will get it." Hint: It won't be us. Not with this mentality! Moak has done and continues to do a tremendous amount of damage to our profession. Like somebody else said, unfreakingbelievable.

scambo1

I agree. Totally unsat, epic fail!!