I'll take 8633 plus the current PS. How's that?

 

Yes. We will call it 8/ /3/3. Unlike the 8/6/3/3 that our union initially told us it was.


Yes. We understood we were being misled from the very beginning.

 

Ah, so they just needed to hold the 8% until Jan 1 rather than start it on July 1. Then it would have been (14-6)/3/3 or 8/3/3, right? You want to pocket the six months early with your / / as though we missed a year. That's not honest.

 

Super. You did. For how long? Oh, you do realize that you would have received every penny of that under the new agreement, right? 6% of it would just have been in 24 payments per year. No way we ever would have lost money with the conversion as some still claim.

 

Nobody here, at least I know me for sure, claimed that. I showed the math early on that it was a raise.

What we were told was that is was 8633+PS. But it wasn't 8633+2012PS.

Why not have 8633+2012PS? We'd make more money, are you not all for that?

 

Okay, I guess we will see how the staffing issue plays out. They got really behind because they delayed hiring for the 717's. Now the 717's are almost done arriving and the 321's and 737-900's are going to be mostly replacements for other aircraft, with some growth. They still have to hire for some attrition and some growth, but mainline domestic block hours have gone up about 25% in the last two years. That is not going to continue. Now that we rejected the E-190's, Delta has told the MEC that they are going to get the rest of the 76 seaters that they are allowed and are pulling 50 seaters out of the desert. I guess that is a big victory for the "No" crowd but it doesn't seem that way to me.

Bartels has a long history of overplaying his hand. Go back and read his lengthy resume from his run at MEC Chairman. Find one thing in there that resulted in any type of gains for pilots. The only accomplishments he can name are changing internal processes. Wow, Policy Manual man strikes again.

He micromanaged his MEC during Chapter 11 and brought home a bankruptcy contract so bad it was a negative factor in the seniority integration. He overplayed his hand in January/February 2008 and cost his pilots $200 million. He over estimated his leverage in April 2008 and got left out in the cold when he found out that management really would move on without him. He played the same over hyped rhetoric game during the seniority arbitration and accomplished none of his goals. In fact, his merger committee was so hog tied by Bartels that they walked out of mediation because they had no latitude to participate in a meaningful fashion. It is ironic that part of Bartels hold on pilots is convincing NWA pilots that they were screwed in the merger when in fact he was the one that screwed them.

He has never been a part of any successful negotiation ever in his entire ALPA career, but has been supremely successful in character assassination and scapegoating his fellow union reps. Ask McClain, Dollaway, Lazarowicz, and now Donatelli and the negotiators. All are charter members of the Bartels Back Stabbing club.

You want transparency, but only when it follows your narrow agenda. There are two sides to the transparency coin and this is my side. Deal with it.

It is pretty simple. Anderson told us what would happen if we rejected this deal. The "No" crowd told him to go take a hike. Now he is doing exactly what he said he would do. He is not treating you like petulant children. It's just he's not going to waste time with a bunch of people running around conducting a circular firing squad. He's got a business to run and holding pilots' hands is not on his agenda. The "No" crowd wanted this and now they've got it. Quit trying to dream up lame excuses as to why you have management over a barrel. You don't. So just own your "No" and move on. Sometime in 2017 or 2018, or later, we will find out if you made the right choice.

Our leverage was working with management as a trusted business partner to help them accomplish their business plan. Bartels broke that relationship and now we have no leverage. We are already 10% ahead of the industry and will just have to wait until we are 10% behind and then we will get a new deal. I thought that is what you wanted, so quit trying to pretend that there is something else there.

 

Blind guides. You strain out a nat, but swallow a camel.

You were the initial one to suggest we call it a 8/3/3/ raise, instead of taking credit for profit sharing.

My / / (gnat) is exactly where our unions PTP guy told me the profit-sharing was coming out of -- begrudgingly.


My point (camel) is that we were initially told it was a 8/6/3/3 raise and it wasn't.

 

OMG! We are all doomed! We should have voted "yes".

I'll happily, and calmly, work under our current contract until we get a contract we deserve.

I'm in no rush. I've lost nothing.

But nice job with the "drama". You go girl!!

 

Because it was a negotiation?

 

We might not have lost the 5.74%. But, we would have lost on the overall conversion with exec compensation being pulled first (in a potentially unlimited way) and the raising of the 20% threshold to $6.5B.