Got a reference?

 

Well for starters regarding the flow being denied due to performance or attendance. Check out 15-01

Pilots hired by Envoy after October 11, 2011 with an active Performance Advisory or Attendance Control Policy Advisory are not eligible for flow through. Such a pilot may elect to have pending grievance of an active advisory resolved under expedited procedures.

So essentially no guarantee of flow if you, at the companies determination, get sick too often.

In regards to the flow not being guaranteed, well it is only guaranteed to the extent that AA is hiring, so no protection there. I stand pretty firm however in the belief that the last thing Envoy wants to do is slow/remove the flow. They are keenly aware of how important that is to recruitment, as seen in the recent hiring numbers, that any change to that would cause a huge backlash beyond recruitment slowing.

 

They’ve been doing it at PSA

 

Check the contractual language.
PDT Al's has fail ath AA you can come back to PDT no seniority loss, envoy does not. Read the contract. If you dont have one then you dont work here.

 

“Contractual language” is open to interpretation by the company!

So please tell us how they (the company) see it. Because of company interpretations negatively impacting the pilot group is why we needed STRONG, clear, clean, new Reserve Rules.

Why are so many grievances filed against this company’s “contractual language” interpretation and violations with so many requiring settlement?


So you think these 9+ yrs flow and counting guys coming here currently have legal / “contractual language” protection for the flow like the 824 & Protected Pilot group have had?????? Hahah!

 

I agree, someone coming here now should not count on the flow at least not how it current sits. The odds of it surviving in its current form are next to zero. We can’t even discuss reserve rules without the company wanting us to give something up, so just think how they will be regarding something as big as flow.

I also agree that outside the PP’s and 824 group there is vague enough language for a judge to side with the company.

 

Anyone after October 2011 hired at envoy do not fall under 824 or PP pilot group. Check letter 15.01 in contract it explains it clearly.
Any disciplinary or attendance record in you personal file the company can not allow you to flow. You will have to grieve it and arbitrate it, how much money you think alpa will spend on your behalf so you can become an apa member.

Alpa will not fight for any increase in pay, benefits or qol increases because they too dont want to cause any ripples in the water affecting their own flow.

You were paid a bonus to come here with flow, that should have indicated to you that flow is no guarantee being that it's based on AA must be hiring for you to flow. Retirements aside, any down turn in the economy will be a detriment to the flow. AA could not make its numbers even with low fuel prices and airplanes filled like sardine cans.

 

Actually it’s the company not wanting to give on pay and reserve rules, not ALPA my fighting for it.

If ALPA didn’t want to fight, they would have just rolled over and taken the concessions for improvements elsewhere.

 

Doubt your last statement. Alpa just left in place a contract with low pay and poor language in place and reserve as is, this helps management out not the pilots.
When the mec goes public and airs the dirty laundry then maybe just then the mec will be doing something

 

So you want them to agree concessions in order to negotiate then?

You can’t have your cake and eat it too.