Envoy 2019

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04-15-2019 | 07:36 PM

#901

bigtime209

Gets Weekends Off

Joined: Jun 2006

Posts: 1,523

Likes: 0

Quote:

Originally Posted by CrowneVic

Thank you.

I wasn't even going to bother responding, as it is all too clear many individuals posting cannot read or comprehend the written word, and are more interested in trying to appear authoritative.

I appreciate you actually reading what I posted.

Cheers.

Why don't you contact the FAA to get their official stance on this scenario instead of asking on a forum for guys to chime in. For the most part, asking guys that have no idea, myself included, on how the intricacies on this play out. Admittedly, I don't know how all of this part 61 nonsense applies, I'd find it hard to believe that you can anyway claim to pull any type of PIC time while acting as an SIC. But ask an FAA guy with some authority on this if you want an official answer.

04-15-2019 | 07:39 PM

#902

KodiakRS

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Joined: May 2015

Posts: 92

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Quote:

Originally Posted by bigtime209

Things don't get fuzzy at all. The LCA is PIC and the CA candidate is SIC. It's pretty simple.

That's what I thought as far as logging the time, but if I'm remembering my upgrade IOE correctly my LCA had me sign my name in the AML and on the release which I thought was supposed to be done by the PIC. I could be mis-remembering though, pretty much all I remember from CA IOE was frantically trying to understand what the hell the VNAV and auto throttles in the 175 were doing and asking myself why I didn't just wait for a vacancy on an airplane I already knew

04-15-2019 | 07:42 PM

#903

dera

In a land of unicorns

Joined: Apr 2014

Posts: 7,072

Likes: 102

From: Whale FO

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigtime209

For single pilot planes it's legit, logging PIC as PF even when you are SIC is an established practice, and fully endorsed by the FAA. The Nichols letter is the most often quoted reference to this.
The thing is - all of that is only relevant for single pilot airplanes, you cannot be a sole manipulator of controls in a plane requiring two pilots.

04-15-2019 | 08:08 PM

#904

bigtime209

Gets Weekends Off

Joined: Jun 2006

Posts: 1,523

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Quote:

Originally Posted by KodiakRS

You are definitely not remembering your upgrade IOE correctly. Your LCA did not have you sign the AML.

04-15-2019 | 08:32 PM

#905

dera

In a land of unicorns

Joined: Apr 2014

Posts: 7,072

Likes: 102

From: Whale FO

Upgrade IOEs have LCA listed as PIC and the upgradee as FO.

04-16-2019 | 05:59 AM

#906

buddies8

Gets Weekends Off

Joined: Aug 2005

Posts: 3,707

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Your not getting out of here any faster for parker pen flying.

04-16-2019 | 07:14 AM

#907

EagleVol

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Joined: May 2011

Posts: 77

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From: A320

No one logs any PIC until after you complete upgrade IOE and a fed ride. During IOE and the fed ride the LCA is still the PIC no matter which seat they are in.

04-16-2019 | 07:25 AM

#908

3EngineTaxi

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Joined: Dec 2016

Posts: 324

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This discussion has turned into pure silliness. In a Part 121 airline, if you are the SIC, log SIC. If you are the PIC, log PIC. Being the PF while acting as SIC does not allow you log PIC.